Martha Stewart

[notsheigetz]

I was just drinking beer and watching football and I saw an ad by Martha Stewart advertising her wares. I did a search on the forum and didn't get a single hit so if this has ever been discussed before, my apologies.

Ms. Stewart spent 5 months in prison for this......

"According to U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), Stewart avoided a loss of $45,673 by selling all 3,928 shares of her ImClone Systems stock on December 27, 2001, after receiving material, nonpublic information from Peter Bacanovic, who was Stewart's broker at Merrill Lynch. The day following her sale, the stock value fell 16%."

As I understood the case at the time however, the sentence above from Wikipedia doesn't even adequately explain what she was actually convicted of. What the conviction was really all about was deleting the phone message from her telephone where her broker told her to sell and thus "obstructing justice" by deleting evidence that could put her in jail.

Am I the only one who thinks the American legal system is insane?

[craigr]

My understanding is her other crime was lying to investigators. Which brings us to this video on how to handle any kind of encounter with law enforcement:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

Here are the exact steps you should take when confronted with a law enforcement interrogation whether you are guilty or innocent:

1) Shut up and state that you refuse to answer any questions and you want to speak to an attorney.
2) Repeat step 1 until you get to speak to an actual attorney.

Those are the only two things you should be doing if you ever find yourself arrested, under investigation or being questioned by the police.

[dualstow]

More often than not, after I say goodnight to my wife I put an earphone in the ear that is not on the pillow and play HB's archives all night. This morning, I heard him talking about Martha Stewart and how the information that she received was not even that valuable.

But, if she lied to investigators, that's something else altogether. Wiki mentions 9 counts including obstruction of justice.

[notsheigetz]

But, if she lied to investigators, that's something else altogether. Wiki mentions 9 counts including obstruction of justice.

As the other posts pointed out - keep your mouth shut when talking to anyone from the government.

Don't assume it's a fair game. The government can legally lie to you with impunity. Always assume they are your adversary because they are. So keep your mouth shut.

I believe they would have put her in jail no matter what because she was a rich bitch and they got feathers in their caps.  If she had left those messages on her answering system without deleting them I don't think the outcome would have been any different. And she probably knew that too.

[AdamA]

Here's what Harry Browne had to say about this:

June 2003
http://www.harrybrowne.org/articles/MarthaStewart.htm

March 2004
http://www.harrybrowne.org/articles/MarthaStewart2.htm

[MachineGhost]

Am I the only one who thinks the American legal system is insane?

It's not the legal system, its hubris, ego and politically-driven District Attorneys.**  One of the best things we could ever do is remove that position from being democratically elected.  It is hopelessly corrupt and no more anywhere than in the Southern Distrct of New York (notice how Facebook's case just got transferred there).

** You may want to look up Rudy Gulliani's history to see exactly what I mean.

[Ad Orientem]

My understanding is her other crime was lying to investigators. Which brings us to this video on how to handle any kind of encounter with law enforcement:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

Here are the exact steps you should take when confronted with a law enforcement interrogation whether you are guilty or innocent:

1) Shut up and state that you refuse to answer any questions and you want to speak to an attorney.
2) Repeat step 1 until you get to speak to an actual attorney.

Those are the only two things you should be doing if you ever find yourself arrested, under investigation or being questioned by the police.

Many years ago I got some free advice from a lawyer friend of my dad's. He told me that if you ever find myself in a situation where a cop is reading you your rights then the only words that come out of your mouth are "I want a lawyer." It doesn't matter if they just want to know where you were on the night Abe Lincoln was shot. You want a lawyer and you don't say another word until you have one.

[dualstow]

I'm 17 minutes into that video, Craig, and I really like the speaker's delivery & content.
You should remind everyone, though, as you have in the past, that you have worked with policemen and that you don't have anything against them. (Unless I remember wrong).
This is just the system we have to deal with.

[craigr]

I'm 17 minutes into that video, Craig, and I really like the speaker's delivery & content.
You should remind everyone, though, as you have in the past, that you have worked with policemen and that you don't have anything against them. (Unless I remember wrong).
This is just the system we have to deal with.

My degree is in Criminology and Criminal Justice and have worked with police. I have nothing against the police as it is often a dangerous and thankless job.

I will tell you flat out that the police officers I knew told their own kids the exact same thing I said above! The police knew themselves to never talk to the police. They are just doing their job and refusing to answer them isn't going to make your situation any worse.

Many places in this world do not have protection against self-incrimination. So be glad it's something we still have here and use it if you need to! When questioned by law enforcement the best thing you can possibly do is shut-up and get an attorney to do your talking. Period.