Kresser on having perspective on Paleo (incl perfect diet)

[Benko]

1.  http://chriskresser.com/food-fascism-and-the-8020-rule

...that doesn’t mean it’s impossible to be healthy while eating foods that are not considered “Paleo”?, regardless of what the Paleo zealots will tell you

The Paleo diet excludes dairy products and grains. Yet Weston A. Price identified isolated groups of people, like the traditional Swiss Loetschental, who were exceptionally healthy and subsisted primarily on a diet of bread, milk & cheese.

...legumes and nightshades. They aren’t Paleo, but I haven’t seen any evidence to convince me that these foods play a significant role in the modern disease epidemic.

I also suggest they follow what I call the 80/20 rule. 80% of the time they should follow the guidelines very closely, and 20% of the time they’re free to loosen up and just eat what they want to eat. [for healthy people].
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2. [not from his article] The intestinal lining is made of cells that rapidly divide and replace themselves, so it is not difficult to see how healthy people could eat substances which can be shown to cause some degree of tissue damage in studies and not have any problems.

I believe even Gumby said he eats some oatmeal.

Obviously people with "gut issues" may be better off being more strict the things and Kessler goes on to say that.

[Benko]

I should have added the things that he finds the data most convincing  that are bad for us:

--wheat,
--sugar/high-fructose corn syrup and
--industrial seed oils are toxic to the body and contribute to virtually all modern, degenerative diseases – from diabetes and obesity to heart disease and autoimmunity.

--There’s also substantial evidence that soy, in its processed form (i.e. soy milk, soy protein isolate, etc.) is an endocrine disruptor and anti-nutrient and is best avoided.

[Gumby]

I should have added the things that he finds the data most convincing  that are bad for us:

--wheat,
--sugar/high-fructose corn syrup and
--industrial seed oils are toxic to the body and contribute to virtually all modern, degenerative diseases – from diabetes and obesity to heart disease and autoimmunity.

--There’s also substantial evidence that soy, in its processed form (i.e. soy milk, soy protein isolate, etc.) is an endocrine disruptor and anti-nutrient and is best avoided.

In spite of various google searches, I can't seem to get a straight answer as to what constitues industrial seed oil. Could you provide a list of oils to avoid, or a link? Thanks.

Usually polyunsaturated oils such as corn, safflower, sunflower, soybean, cottonseed and canola.

[Pointedstick]

Out of curiosity, does sesame oil count? At this point I mostly cook with coconut oil, avocado oil, and high-quality olive oil (mostly eaten raw on salads) but have yet to find a great answer about the sesame oil.

[Gumby]

Out of curiosity, does sesame oil count? At this point I mostly cook with coconut oil, avocado oil, and high-quality olive oil (mostly eaten raw on salads) but have yet to find a great answer about the sesame oil.

From Mary G. Enig, PhD and Sally Fallon at the Weston A. Price Foundation:

Peanut Oil contains 48% oleic acid, 18% saturated fat and 34% omega-6 linoleic acid. Like olive oil, peanut oil is relatively stable and, therefore, appropriate for stir-frys on occasion. But the high percentage of omega-6 presents a potential danger, so use of peanut oil should be strictly limited.

Sesame Oil contains 42% oleic acid, 15% saturated fat, and 43% omega-6 linoleic acid. Sesame oil is similar in composition to peanut oil. It can be used for frying because it contains unique antioxidants that are not destroyed by heat. However, the high percentage of omega-6 militates against exclusive use.

Source: http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-f ... ny-on-fats

I read in Cooks Illustrated that it's best to refrigerate these oils if you aren't going to use them very often (to prevent oxidation). They will turn solid in the refrigerator (since they are mostly monounsaturated), but will re-liquify under hot water or by taking them out of the fridge when you bring home the groceries.

[moda0306]

So what are the best high-heat non-olive oils to cook with?

I love olive oil until I turn the heat up too high and the $hit starts popping all over my kitchen.

[Pointedstick]

Avocado oil! It's got basically the same oxidation temperature as canola oil: 450F. Great stuff. A bit pricey, although it will last forever if you only ever use it for high-temperature frying and baking. I bought 2 lbs on Amazon last October for $20 and am only now about halfway through the second can. Couldn't be happier with the stuff; highly recommended.

[Pointedstick]

Also another thing: this is a quirk with Amazon but you can order it as a subscription to save 5% and then immediately cancel the subscription with no penalty. That brings the price down below $20 for the pair of 17oz cans! You can also do this with any "Subscribe & Save" item on Amazon.

[Gumby]

Avocado oil! It's got basically the same oxidation temperature as canola oil: 450F.

Avocado oil is good. Keep in mind that "oxidation" happens at a lower temperature than smoke point. So, while oxidation and smoke point are related, you want to avoid going crazy with the heat when possible.

I prefer to cook at low heat (below 350º) whenever possible (mostly with coconut oil, ghee, butter and sometimes lard if I want great taste and a little browning). High heat tends to increase toxins, AGEs and oxidation, but some meals do need high heat on occasion.

As stated in a previous quote, Peanut oil and Sesame Oil are also good for high heat stir fry recipes — but don't make them a staple of your diet because they are high in Omega-6.

Beef and Mutton Tallows are the best for high heat deep frying, though they can be a bit smelly and stink up your kitchen. Use grass fed when possible.

Duck Fat is extremely good at frying/roasting potatoes in/on high heat.

Ghee is excellent for searing (Scallops, beef, etc.) It doesn't have any milk solids that will burn. But, the smoke point isn't as high as some of the oils mentioned above.

There is a good summary at the end of the article I cited above:

http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-f ... ny-on-fats

[Benko]

You can just use coconut oil (they make a kind without the coconut oil taste) for frying at high temp.

Keep in mind that cooking at high temps does have it's own disadvantages--it produces more unhealthy substances.  not speaking oxidation, but the stuff that is found in french fries (forget what it is called). 

[Gumby]

You can just use coconut oil (they make a kind without the coconut oil taste) for frying at high temp.

I believe refined coconut oil has no taste, but it's best to avoid refined coconut oil. It's inferior.

Here's a very extensive guide to the best/worst coconut oil brands and what to look for:

http://www.evolvingwellness.com/essay/h ... rst-brands

Keep in mind that cooking at high temps does have it's own disadvantages--it produces more unhealthy substances.  not speaking oxidation, but the stuff that is found in french fries (forget what it is called).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acrylamide

[MachineGhost]

Avocado oil! It's got basically the same oxidation temperature as canola oil: 450F. Great stuff. A bit pricey, although it will last forever if you only ever use it for high-temperature frying and baking. I bought 2 lbs on Amazon last October for $20 and am only now about halfway through the second can. Couldn't be happier with the stuff; highly recommended.

I used to eat potato chips now and then fried with avocado oil until Sprouts stopped carrying it.  Bastids!  Maybe I'll get some and make it at home.

The grass-fed beef tallow has been a disaster.  Absolute atrocious smelling, stinking stuff.  Too bad I bought 6 large containers.   I don't know what to do with them, but I just cannot stink up the house with it ever again.

[smurff]

So what are the best high-heat non-olive oils to cook with?

I love olive oil until I turn the heat up too high and the $hit starts popping all over my kitchen.

Coconut, avocado, macadamia nut oils are great for frying.

Beef tallow, organic lard are great for frying, but as MachineGhost pointed out, beef tallow has a strong odor many people don't like.

[Pointedstick]

I used to eat potato chips now and then fried with avocado oil until Sprouts stopped carrying it.  Bastids!  Maybe I'll get some and make it at home.

The grass-fed beef tallow has been a disaster.  Absolute atrocious smelling, stinking stuff.  Too bad I bought 6 large containers.   I don't know what to do with them, but I just cannot stink up the house with it ever again.

I'll take what's left. What do you want for it?

[MachineGhost]

I'll take what's left. What do you want for it?

Tempting, but I can't in good conscience resell it to you because the freezer failed and it was placed in the fridge for a few weeks before refreezing.  It may not be safe.

What's your secret to tolerating it?  Not only is it stinky, its greasy and gaseous too and sticks to every surface in the kitchen.  Not fun to clean off.

[Pointedstick]

I've never actually had any before. I was just interested in trying it.

[escafandro]

Where I live only sells sunflower, corn, soybeans, canola and olive oil.
What would be the least bad for frying and cook in the oven?

[smurff]

McDonald's used to fry their potatoes in a version of tallow, until sometime in the 1990s, when vegetarians learned about it and protested.  They now use a vegetable oil blend.

[smurff]

Where I live only sells sunflower, corn, soybeans, canola and olive oil.
What would be the least bad for frying and cook in the oven?

Olive oil is pretty good.  Just don't allow it to get so hot that it smokes.