Reasons why I will not be getting injected for the Wuhan

[murphy_p_t]

My own view is that the injection test subjects are victims of a massive, full spectrum, psychological warfare operation.

[SomeDude]

My own view is that the injection test subjects are victims of a massive, full spectrum, psychological warfare operation.

We are all victims of the operation. We had a fake election based on it and massive curtailing of rights. The church of covid group makes the strawman argument that non-believers expect piles of bodies and the lack of mountains of corpses proves we're wrong to disagree with CNN, FOX, Faucci, Biden, Gates, Zuckerberg, TYT, and Trump.

No disease, real or imagined is worth giving up your rights.

Regarding it being imagined, I've still never met a single person who got sick from it or told me they knew someone who got sick from it (apart from the internet). That is in stark contrast to the umm....vaccine.

[murphy_p_t]

"We are all victims of the operation."

I choose to resist this unjust assault. As I know you do from the rest of your remarks.

[murphy_p_t]

https://principia-scientific.com/doctor ... st-people/


Become a test subject... Get blood clots??!!

[jalanlong]

What am I missing to tilt the scale to NOT get the vaccine.

From the "facts" / assertions I've listed above it seems that the risk / reward ratio greatly points toward getting the vaccine.

Well I see there are a couple of things you are missing. One is that while you may feel there is very little chance of a short term issue with the vaccine, you have no way of knowing the long-term effects. Secondly, studies from Europe (one from Austria being the most prominent) show that people who have the natural antibodies from getting Covid have a protection that is at the highest estimate to what the vaccines can provide.

Therefore I see my chances as either 1) I do not get Covid and therefore don't need to worry about a vaccine or 2) I get Covid and end up with a natural immunity that is better than the vaccine can provide to me. Both of those scenarios are a better tradeoff to me than getting a vaccine for an illness I do not have and hoping that it does not have long term effects.

[Xan]

https://principia-scientific.com/doctor ... st-people/


Become a test subject... Get blood clots??!!

Most will die in a few short years from heart failure

Could we draw some parameters around this? If, let's say at the start of 2025, less than 10% of people who are currently under age 70 and who got an mRNA vaccine have died, will you admit this was wrong?

[Xan]

Therefore I see my chances as either 1) I do not get Covid and therefore don't need to worry about a vaccine or 2) I get Covid and end up with a natural immunity that is better than the vaccine can provide to me. Both of those scenarios are a better tradeoff to me than getting a vaccine for an illness I do not have and hoping that it does not have long term effects.

We also don't know the long-term effects of contracting the virus.

[SomeDude]

Therefore I see my chances as either 1) I do not get Covid and therefore don't need to worry about a vaccine or 2) I get Covid and end up with a natural immunity that is better than the vaccine can provide to me. Both of those scenarios are a better tradeoff to me than getting a vaccine for an illness I do not have and hoping that it does not have long term effects.

We also don't know the long-term effects of contracting the virus.

This is a factor that i have some confusion about. Does the vaccine actually reduce the likelihood of contracting the virus? My understanding was it does not.

[SomeDude]

Therefore I see my chances as either 1) I do not get Covid and therefore don't need to worry about a vaccine or 2) I get Covid and end up with a natural immunity that is better than the vaccine can provide to me. Both of those scenarios are a better tradeoff to me than getting a vaccine for an illness I do not have and hoping that it does not have long term effects.

We also don't know the long-term effects of contracting the virus.

This is a factor that i have some confusion about. Does the vaccine actually reduce the likelihood of contracting the virus? My understanding was it does not.

One other point here.....if you take the vaccine you are 100% certain to have exposed yourself to this unknown risk of long term effects from the vax even if you've eliminated the risk of contracting the virus.

If you don't take the vaccine, you are at less than 100% exposure of the unknown risk of long term effects of the virus.

[WiseOne]

Therefore I see my chances as either 1) I do not get Covid and therefore don't need to worry about a vaccine or 2) I get Covid and end up with a natural immunity that is better than the vaccine can provide to me. Both of those scenarios are a better tradeoff to me than getting a vaccine for an illness I do not have and hoping that it does not have long term effects.

We also don't know the long-term effects of contracting the virus.

This is a factor that i have some confusion about. Does the vaccine actually reduce the likelihood of contracting the virus? My understanding was it does not.

These are both key questions. From what I've gathered, "long COVID" can come about even through subclinical infection. If that's true, then it's really not clear whether the vaccines will prevent it. Not to mention that there is no evidence that vaccines prevent long COVID.

I still am very skeptical that long COVID is anything but a psychiatric reaction to getting a scary disease, or that the victims aren't basically the same as the "chronic Lyme" crowd. Functional/psychogenic neurological problems were a huge problem, an epidemic even, well before COVID came on the scene. I guess in that sense, the vaccine will prevent long COVID since the recipients will be less terrified of getting sick.

[stuper1]

Good, then people like me who basically see Covid as a bad flu bug and aren't scared to death of it should be at zero risk of long Covid.

[Tortoise]

The long-term effects of Covid are not yet known.

The long-term effects of the Covid vaccine are not yet known.

So either way, there is a risk. That's the long and the short of it. Pick your poison.

In spite of that simple reality, the reason why this remains a contentious issue is because our large institutions -- public health, political, educational, business, etc. -- by and large are unrelentingly propagating the falsehood that we know the vaccines are perfectly safe in the short- and long-term and that the correct choice for practically everyone is to get the vaccine.

Stop lying to people, and stop treating adults like they're children or dummies, and we can probably all move past this.

[murphy_p_t]

I think the American population essentially was moving beyond. There are big music festivals going on now.

But then the puppet Masters who pull ventriloquist biden's limbs said that he's sending federal agents door to door.

[pp4me]

The long-term effects of Covid are not yet known.

The long-term effects of the Covid vaccine are not yet known.

So either way, there is a risk. That's the long and the short of it. Pick your poison.

On the side of the vaccine you can also factor in the numerous other vaccinations you have gotten over the years, probably all of which had some reports of side effects. That figured into my decision to get the jabs.

As for Covid, I can't think of any similar experiment I have ever done on my body.

[Tortoise]

On the side of the vaccine you can also factor in the numerous other vaccinations you have gotten over the years, probably all of which had some reports of side effects. That figured into my decision to get the jabs.

Were any of those vaccines you got over the years based on an experimental biotechnology that wasn't yet officially approved by the FDA?

[yankees60]

According to what I'd posted here earlier...Missouri seems to be in the lower third of having received at least one shot of the vaccine (about 52%). Therefore I was surprised to see such a cartoon as the below in a Missouri newspaper. However, this may explain why it was in this particular Missouri newspaper:

"The Columbia Missourian is a digital-first newspaper based in Columbia, Missouri, published seven days a week on www.columbiamissourian.com and five days a week in print. The newspaper is affiliated with the Missouri School of Journalism, and is owned as a 501c3 non-profit under the Missourian Publishing Association. Students enrolled in staff classes produce the newspaper, which is managed by working professionals who also serve as professors."

Still somewhat humorous...or "tragi-comic"?

Vinny

Capture.JPG (183.63 KiB) Viewed 5078 times

[flyingpylon]

Therefore I see my chances as either 1) I do not get Covid and therefore don't need to worry about a vaccine or 2) I get Covid and end up with a natural immunity that is better than the vaccine can provide to me. Both of those scenarios are a better tradeoff to me than getting a vaccine for an illness I do not have and hoping that it does not have long term effects.

We also don't know the long-term effects of contracting the virus.

This is a factor that i have some confusion about. Does the vaccine actually reduce the likelihood of contracting the virus? My understanding was it does not.

These are both key questions. From what I've gathered, "long COVID" can come about even through subclinical infection. If that's true, then it's really not clear whether the vaccines will prevent it. Not to mention that there is no evidence that vaccines prevent long COVID.

I still am very skeptical that long COVID is anything but a psychiatric reaction to getting a scary disease, or that the victims aren't basically the same as the "chronic Lyme" crowd. Functional/psychogenic neurological problems were a huge problem, an epidemic even, well before COVID came on the scene. I guess in that sense, the vaccine will prevent long COVID since the recipients will be less terrified of getting sick.

Seems like it's an actual thing, but I don't know. It's also been observed in some people that have received vaccines. The FLCCC has some information and a management protocol here:

https://covid19criticalcare.com/covid-1 ... -protocol/

[SomeDude]

As for Covid, I can't think of any similar experiment I have ever done on my body.

This makes me sad PP. Live a little man.

[Maddy]

[w]hy has this become so politicized?

Quite possibly because it was ALWAYS political.

[Cortopassi]

Just asking a question here, now that we sort of have another nation-wide experiment. What do you all who won't get vaccinated make of these reports that have been coming out? And I'd ask please don't just brush it aside that it's all part of the grand plan or something.
----------------
Los Angeles County officials reported the fourth straight day of more than 1,000 new COVID-19 cases on Monday, more troubling evidence that the disease is increasing its spread among the unvaccinated.

The county Department of Public Health reported 1,059 new cases Monday. On Friday, 1,044 coronavirus cases were reported countywide, followed by 1,069 more on Saturday and an additional 1,113 Sunday, according to data compiled by The Times.

“Over 99% of the COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths we are seeing are among unvaccinated individuals,” county Public Health Director Barbara Ferrer said in a statement Monday.

https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... vaccinated

[stuper1]

What I make of these reports is that they are very vague.

Ok, there are 1,000+ cases.

How many of those "cases" are people that actually show any symptoms? You see that the reports don't tell us that, do they?

How many of the cases were among people who were vaccinated versus unvaccinated? Again, these so-called reports don't tell us, do they?

How many hospitalizations and deaths are involved among these "cases"? Again, not reported.

How do those rates of hospitalization and death compare to the common flu? Again, not reported.

What were the age and comorbidity profiles of those hospitalized or dead? Again, not reported, but presumably 99.99% of the people were over 75 years old and/or had a comorbidity.

If you guys can't see by now that all of this stuff is just propaganda trying to scare people, I don't know what to tell you. Mind you, I don't think Covid was some sort of grand plan to start with. I think it is an actual disease, but the response was overblown and mismanaged (never let a good crisis go to waste, you know), and now the powers that be are just trying to cover their tracks. Why was the response overblown and mismanaged? That's easy ... because it benefited big business. They were able to get Trump out of office and put small businesses out of business at the same time - a win, win for them.

[Cortopassi]

What I make of these reports is that they are very vague.

Ok, there are 1,000+ cases.

How many of those "cases" are people that actually show any symptoms? You see that the reports don't tell us that, do they?

How many of the cases were among people who were vaccinated versus unvaccinated? Again, these so-called reports don't tell us, do they?

How many hospitalizations and deaths are involved among these "cases"? Again, not reported.

How do those rates of hospitalization and death compare to the common flu? Again, not reported.

What were the age and comorbidity profiles of those hospitalized or dead? Again, not reported, but presumably 99.99% of the people were over 75 years old and/or had a comorbidity.

If you guys can't see by now that all of this stuff is just propaganda trying to scare people, I don't know what to tell you. Mind you, I don't think Covid was some sort of grand plan to start with. I think it is an actual disease, but the response was overblown and mismanaged (never let a good crisis go to waste, you know), and now the powers that be are just trying to cover their tracks. Why was the response overblown and mismanaged? That's easy ... because it benefited big business. They were able to get Trump out of office and put small businesses out of business at the same time - a win, win for them.

I agree that there is a propaganda aspect to this to get people to take the vaccine.

But to most of your questions, doesn't the article statement "Over 99% of the COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths we are seeing are among unvaccinated individuals," answer those??

And I would think by this time, 1.5 years in, that unless there is still surveillance testing, that cases are mainly people who feel ill and want to see what they have?

[WiseOne]

Just occurred to me...wouldn't there be a testing bias at work here?

If you're vaccinated against COVID and you get sick, wouldn't you be less likely to run out and get a COVID test than if you're unvaccinated? And wouldn't your employer be less likely to require random and exposure-based testing?

Hospitalizations and deaths I can believe are more common among the unvaccinated, but...cases??? The vaccines don't prevent infection, so asymptomatic cases (yes I know, that's an oxymoron) should be just as common in the vaccinated population. And there should be a measurable percentage of cases with mild illness among the vaccinated population, as well. So I'm not sure the "99%+" is believable.

[Cortopassi]

Just occurred to me...wouldn't there be a testing bias at work here?

For sure to some extent.

But I'd also have to believe that the un-vaccinated are generally a group who more likely wouldn't feel a need to get tested, right? I've just got the sniffles, not Covid mentality? So it is interesting.

[jalanlong]

[w]hy has this become so politicized?

Quite possibly because it was ALWAYS political.

Anytime there is something that has data or evidence that is not clear cut, things are going to divide down on political lines. There is evidence for and against vaccines, masks, lockdowns etc. When confronted with different lines of thought, people are naturally going to fall back on their personal beliefs. So whether or not you agree with lockdowns (for example) will mostly depend on your views on person freedom, your priorities of health vs economy, your trust of authority figures etc. And ultimately that tends to break people into political groups.