My answer?Mountaineer wrote:No. I'm not being clear enough. I'm not assuming anything (other than you can read what I'm writing and think somewhat in an unbiased manner). Forget Christianity for a moment. I'm asking if you don't want to believe in "original sin" as an explanation for why man is the way he is - what is your explanation - don't presume to read my mind and think I have a hidden agenda. I'm saying if you don't like the "original sin" explanation, make a better case, don't just tear down what has come before - build up and make a better case. That itself even raises the question of why do people try to tear down instead of build up so much? Why do so many need someone they feel is lesser than them to feel good about themselves (i.e. tell racial jokes, ethnic jokes, etc.)? Why do some think humans evolve to get better and better instead of following the physical law of entropy (feces run downhill) like the rest of the observable does? Why do we die? Why do we seem to be inherently mostly bad and not good? Why do people cut others off in traffic instead of yielding? Why do babies scream when they don't get their own way? That kind of thing. You can think of other situations and comment on them as you like - the above are only suggestions.madbean2 wrote:Again, you are assuming that the natural state of man ought to be some sort of utopia and then asking why that isn't so. And I say I don't accept your initial premise to begin with and therefore there is no answer to the question in the way that you have posed it.Mountaineer wrote: I get what you are saying, but my question was how do you account for the human condition being what it is. Why are we the way we are. I agree we are all those nasty things ... but why nasty vs. kind and considerate of others, why nasty vs. anything else? Why care if some one steals from you - why not want to share what you have? Why don't we live in the StarTrek utopia instead of a place where work and effort are required?
You might as well ask why every kid in the world doesn't get a present from Santa Claus on Christmas morning.
I don't know.
And I don't think I ever will. This is just the way we seem to be, yet at the same time we're capable of great acts of selflessness and charity and beauty as well. Why? Not a clue. And I guess that "why" isn't really that interesting to me. It seems like a fundamentally unanswerable question, and in general, such questions don't really hold much interest for me. I don't lie awake at night wondering, "Why is man capable of such evil?" and the like.
) ..... I can remember disassembling clocks, radios, all sorts of mechanical gadgets as a kid ... some of them I was even able to reassemble and get them to work 
I remember being a real pain in the ass to my family and teachers from my inquisitiveness and sometimes coming up with questions they could not answer - the smart people encouraged me, the not so enlightened ones just told me to shut up. I guess I have trouble relating to understanding why people are satisfied stumbling through life in a fog. You certainly do not seem to be that kind of person - you seem very intelligent. Maybe when you get through the demands of raising a kid you will have more time to ponder the mysteries of life and the creation. I know I was consumed by my job, family, and such while I was working 70 hours a week and did not have much extra mental energy to devote to "asking why on the fundamentals of life". Oh well ... sorry for rambling. And, for what it is worth, being the best husband and father you can be is extremely important from my perspective; your priority is right on - passing along healthy values and teaching others to think clearly is very important to the future of this rock we inhabit - allowing a child to believe he is the boss and there is no authority outside himeslf is ultimately harmful to both him and society - even though you may think you are being kind to him in the moment.