Ubuntu-- Still Not Ready For Prime Time

[Coffee]

Unless you're a computer programmer-- you probably don't want to bother with Ubuntu, yet.  

If you only use the computer for surfing the web and checking your Gmail, then it's probably fine.  But try plugging a printer in-- or using iTunes-- or anything else that might require a driver and... forgetaboutit!!

YMMV.

[craigr]

Yeah. Pretty much sums up all Linux distros on the desktop. The distros are too worried about having 1,000,000 different themes and not enough on getting the basics working well. Linux is a fine server, but if you want desktop Unix then get Mac OS X.

[TBV]

Whether an OS can support a certain peripheral has a lot to do with the cooperation of the company that makes the peripheral.  Having said that, those looking to find out which printers will work well can look here: http://www.linuxfoundation.org/collabor ... enprinting.  You'll find that HP is the leader in Linux interoperability.

Personally, I've found Ubuntu to be easy to install and customize.  It recognizes thumb drives and compatible printers well, not to mention providing read/write access to Windows NTSF partitions.  One perennial sticking point is fax capability, but that is a dying technology anyway, one easily handled by using eFax for those who must have it.

And for those who really are computer geeks, Linux comes complete with forensics capabilities (imaging and searching of imaged drives) that would cost you thousands if purchased as a separate package.  Some law enforcement agencies use Linux for this very reason.

[KevinW]

Well, I use Linux almost exclusively at work and at home and it meets all my needs.  So I guess my mileage has varied.

Things run a lot more smoothly when you buy hardware with Linux specifically in mind, and adapt to using Linux-native software instead of expecting that Windows software can work seamlessly.  Given the realities of the computer market it isn't realistic to take a bunch of hardware and software that was set up for Windows and expect Linux to handle it all gracefully.

All these OSs have their problems.  I like Linux because I can usually overcome its limitations through skill (learning to configure things) or planning (buying known compatible hardware).  With Windows a lot of problems are simply unfixable (e.g. the horrendous security architecture) or can only be fixed by Microsoft, which puts you in the position of waiting and/or begging.

[gizmo_rat]

Like them or loath them, it seems that the only innovation going on on the desktop is in the linux distros.

I like to give my kids a choice of OS, but although they are happy enough using Ubuntu and OS X I always find them booted into Win 7. Meh.

[MediumTex]

This topic reminds me of how I might feel overhearing a discussion among members of one of those tribes whose language consists of a series of clicking and popping sounds.

I would probably just assume that Ubuntu was a candidate to lead the tribe some day, and the chatter was over Ubuntu's relative strengths and weaknesses in relation to his peers.

[Coffee]

"I heard Charles Ubuntu and his men wiped out a neighboring village."

[dualstow]

Coffee, I agree with the first two statements in your OP, but I plugged a printer in and it was recognized immediately. Then again, I am running Mint 10, which is built on Ubuntu, but which has extra things like Adobe flash and, perhaps, printer drivers.
For those afraid of pure Ubuntu, perhaps Linux Mint is a good stepping stone.

Meanwhile, my Brother brand printer is *not* recognized by my wife's new Windows 7 machine. I'm not sure what's going on there, because it's in Chinese.

[TBV]

This topic reminds me of how I might feel overhearing a discussion among members of one of those tribes whose language consists of a series of clicking and popping sounds.

I would probably just assume that Ubuntu was a candidate to lead the tribe some day, and the chatter was over Ubuntu's relative strengths and weaknesses in relation to his peers.

Actually, the word Ubuntu has its roots in the same Southern African language family (Bantu) as the Xhosa language you're referring to.  Remember Pata Pata?

Since this is an investor's site, I'd expect a friendlier reception for a product that offers choice of strategies (being Linux, you can pick from several programs for every function), ease of use (no CS degree needed), low expense ratios (no annual Windows/Norton security tax), killer yields (ROI is great since the cost is ZERO), built-in hedging (you can dual boot and read-write to Windows files) and ST/LT exposure (in the form of your choice of update cycles.)  Ubuntu...the perfect permanent OS!!

(And don't forget GnuCash for managing your finances. Double-entry? -check, Multiple currencies? - check, Cap Gains? - check, Real-time quote updates? - check, Multiple brokerage account tracking? - check, Tax tracking? - check, Handy reports? - check, Free? - check.)

[Storm]

This is an interesting discussion.  I run over 100 Linux servers at work.  Most of them run Oracle database software.  I'm perfectly happy that Linux is an obscure, hard to use operating system, because it keeps me in six digit salary range and highly in demand...  ;D

Although at home I run a mix of Mac OS X (can't beat it for being the most easy to use operating system, with UNIX underneath to make it powerful) and Windows 7 (can't beat it for gaming).

I find Linux to be a great server OS - if you need to run a website or a database, Linux is where you should run it, and Mac OS X to be a great desktop OS.  Just like a gardener or a mechanic, there is a right tool for every job.

[Coffee]

I'm sure it is great.  I'd love to use it.  But it's not plug and play, for our Brother printer... whereas Win 7 is.

[l82start]

i have an old lap top i just upgraded (more ram, faster drive, more gig ) and i am considering making it a duel boot just for fun, i have always shied away from Linux for the compatibility reasons that others have already listed, i like plug it in and go, but i am on a teach myself new tricks kick and being familiar with Linux OS seems like it might be fun and possibly useful some day... 

[dualstow]

I'm sure it is great.  I'd love to use it.  But it's not plug and play, for our Brother printer... whereas Win 7 is.

Don't know if you saw my post above, but Linux Mint is plug-and-play, and my Brother printer was immediately recognized by it.

[Storm]

I really like Linux Mint - it's easy to use like Ubuntu, but it also has all of the nice things you expect like a Flash plugin that works, as well as video codecs so you can watch most videos you download from the net.  Most Linux distros tend to alienate their users by being more focused on "free" software, when 99% of the people using the computer just want it to work properly.  I like Linux Mint because it is Linux, but without all of the fundamentalist open source craziness.  Sometimes I just want my Flash plugin to work when I visit a website, as opposed to not being able to view it at all because it offends my open source sensibilities...

[Coffee]

I'm sure it is great.  I'd love to use it.  But it's not plug and play, for our Brother printer... whereas Win 7 is.

Don't know if you saw my post above, but Linux Mint is plug-and-play, and my Brother printer was immediately recognized by it.

Thanks, I'll give it a try.

[dualstow]

Exactly what Storm said.

[Coffee]

I'm having the same kind of ridiculous nonsense with Mint.  I can't even get it to install, either from CD or from the USB.  The closest instructions you can find read like this (below).  Might as well be in Japanese.  Like I said: Still not ready for prime time.  I'm ready to toss the computer through the window...

Creating a CD to Boot Linux Mint 8 or 9 from USB

Note: We accomplished the following while running from a pre-installed Linux Mint 9 Live USB on a machine that does support booting from USB. This enabled us to free up the CD Burner to use to burn the final ISO.

Insert your Linux Mint Live USB or Live CD and restart your computer, booting from the CD or Live USB
Open a Terminal (Menu > Terminal)
Type sudo apt-get install grub
Type mkdir -p mbcd/boot/grub
Type cp /usr/lib/grub/i386-pc/stage2_eltorito mbcd/boot/grub
Type gedit mbcd/boot/grub/menu.lst
Add the following information to your menu.lst file and click save:
title Start Linux MINT from USB
root (cd)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz file=/cdrom/preseed/mint.seed boot=casper noprompt cdrom-detect/try-usb=true persistent
initrd /boot/initrd.lz
boot

Type cp /cdrom/casper/vmlinuz ~/mbcd/boot
Type sudo gedit /etc/initramfs-tools/modules
Add the following lines to the modules file and click save:
usbcore
usb-storage
uhci_hcd
ohci_hcd
ehci_hcd
sd_mod
scsi_mod

Type sudo gedit /etc/initramfs-tools/initramfs.conf
Add the following line to the bottom of the file and click save:
WAIT=8

Type sudo mkinitramfs -o mbcd/boot/initrd.lz
Type mkisofs -R -b boot/grub/stage2_eltorito -no-emul-boot -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -o mintusbcd.iso mbcd
Insert a blank CD and type brasero -i mintusbcd.iso (to burn the ISO to a CD)

[dualstow]

Sorry to hear that. It's a bit late for me to mention this, but since I was unable to install Ubuntu on an old XP box from a live CD, I decided that if I ever tried Linux again, it would be preinstalled by a pro. That way, if I had any problems, I could truly blame them on the OS and not my install or old hardware. After all, my OS X runs on a Mac made for it, and my XP runs on a Gateway PC made for it. So, I found a California company called Zareason that puts whatever you want on their hardware (well, choice of about 10 different Linuxes).  My machine came with Mint 10 pre-installed.

[Coffee]

I could see that being a good solution.

[blackomen]

I've been a Linux user since 2006 and have been using Ubuntu since then.  That doesn't mean I don't use Windows (I'm happy to have it preinstalled on my new computers but I'll install Ubuntu for dual-boot anyways.)

I kinda have the opposite view..  I think you'll need to be a computer programmer if you need to use Ubuntu for anything else other than email or web browsing.  Since those two features are most commonly used, they're most easily supported out of the box without the need for additional tweaking.  Now if you need to scan, print, connect many other devices, play games, etc. then you'd better know a thing or two about Linux..

[dualstow]

I think I agree with this recent article from the Economist.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/babbage/ ... ktop-linux

An excerpt:

All that Linux developers seem to want to do these days is add cool new features, rather than squish existing bugs and make the software more useable.

The problem is compounded by the way Linux has grown over the years into an ungainly edifice, built upon thousands of individual packages of computer code that have been stapled together. Contrast that with the strict quality assurance imposed by Apple and Google over their Unix- and Linux-like operating systems for tablets and phones. Both rely on just 100 or so tightly integrated core packages that have been carefully scrutinised for regressions and inconsistencies. Compared with Linux, the iOS and Android operating systems are remarkabl(y) clean and robust. With the quality of the underlying software a given, it is no surprise that developers have been able to write hundreds of thousands of effective apps for the two platforms.

It's a shame, because I'd rather buy more linux-friendly hardware, but I'll be forced to buy expensive Macs to help ensure that OSX runs properly. An extra $600 for a solid-state drive in the Mac mini? Yikes.

[edsanville]

This topic reminds me of how I might feel overhearing a discussion among members of one of those tribes whose language consists of a series of clicking and popping sounds.

I would probably just assume that Ubuntu was a candidate to lead the tribe some day, and the chatter was over Ubuntu's relative strengths and weaknesses in relation to his peers.

Actually, the word Ubuntu has its roots in the same Southern African language family (Bantu) as the Xhosa language you're referring to.  Remember Pata Pata?

I would have assumed he was talking about a Khoisan language, since that's where the clicking came from originally.  The Xhosa just borrowed it from them.

This message board never ceases to amaze me, there are knowledgeable people for pretty much any subject known to man.  Even the esoteric things that fascinate me for some reason, like linguistics.  If I ever go on "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire,"  I want to use this message board as the "Phone a Friend" option... somehow.

[Pointedstick]

For what it's worth, I use Linux Mint as my primary OS and love it. Then again, I am a UNIX hacker in my day job. But I appreciate that it lets me change anything I feel needs changing. I just kept bumping up against things on OS X that I couldn't change. There are things I miss from OS X, like Bonjour and Time Machine but it's not a huge deal since I know how to deal with the technical underpinning or roll my own solution. I don't think Linux is ever not going to be a nerdy OS for computer nerds, but that's just fine. Linux will always be there for the people who come to place greater value than freedom and openness than tight integration or well-polished but limited features.

[Storm]

For what it's worth, I use Linux Mint as my primary OS and love it. Then again, I am a UNIX hacker in my day job. But I appreciate that it lets me change anything I feel needs changing. I just kept bumping up against things on OS X that I couldn't change. There are things I miss from OS X, like Bonjour and Time Machine but it's not a huge deal since I know how to deal with the technical underpinning or roll my own solution. I don't think Linux is ever not going to be a nerdy OS for computer nerds, but that's just fine. Linux will always be there for the people who come to place greater value than freedom and openness than tight integration or well-polished but limited features.

Cool!  I like Linux Mint as well because it has all the good stuff from Ubuntu, but includes all of the codecs for Flash, audio and video streaming so you don't have to worry about installing all of that junk.  I'm also a UNIX hacker in my day job...  Well, I cut my teeth on SunOS in the 90s but now I mainly work on Red Hat Enterprise Linux servers running Oracle...  RHEL unfortunately doesn't make a very solid desktop OS, mainly because it's more concerned with enterprise stability (like a server should be) rather than running the latest bleeding edge 3.4.8 kernel.

[Pointedstick]

I had a feeling there would be a lot of Linux users here. Comes with the individualist terrain I suppose!