Gyroscopic Investing

I'm just curious how many people use the PP strategy. Any idea?

Good question, Reub. Seems to me that most of the people that I talk to about it sort of get that glazed over look. I would guess that the absolute number is quite low, but I know I am not answering your question. What if it's only like 100 of us?

I am thinking that the count is fairly low judging by the small number of posters here.

I wonder how many copies of the book sold? Would be some indication of the the interest perhaps?
There may be more of us than you think. Those who invest in the PP but don't post much if at all.

Reub wrote: I'm just curious how many people use the PP strategy. Any idea?

I'm more curious about how many people on this forum actually use the PP strategy. I used to think it was most but I've been getting the impression lately that maybe not.

PRPFX has over $8 billion in total assets, so...a few more than a handful. It's close enough to the strict PP IMO.

Perhaps the number of PP "purists" is low, but I do think many people have created their own version of the PP, in accordance with their own risk tolerance.  For example, a Boglehead portfolio + 10% gold, or something similar. 

I’ve created my own cashless version which suits me:  http://www.tightwadweb.com/customportfolio.html

ns3 wrote:

Reub wrote: I'm just curious how many people use the PP strategy. Any idea?

I'm more curious about how many people on this forum actually use the PP strategy. I used to think it was most but I've been getting the impression lately that maybe not.

I adhere to the PP 4x25 allocation in taxable accounts.

It's hard to say because there is no "registry" of users. PRPFX probably has what, 10,000 distinct account holders? American Asset probably has what, a couple hundred clients?

Let's try to ballpark it...Fail Safe Investing's Amazon Best Sellers Rank is #405,024, and The Permanent Portfolio's rank is  #53,708. That doesn't say much about the absolute number of copies sold though. And Fail Safe probably made most of its sales before Amazon existed. The PP page on the ERE wiki ( http://earlyretirementextreme.com/wiki/ ... _Portfolio )  has over 107 thousand impressions. Crawling Road and the podcast archive don't seem to have public hit counts. I have no idea how big the audience of Browne's radio show was.

Altogether maybe 300,000 people have studied the PP well enough to understand and implement it? If 1% of them follow through, there'd be about 3,000 DIY PPs out there? That figure sounds plausible.

I suppose my guesstimate is that there's a couple thousand DIY PPs.

My wife and I each have a PP, but she has no interest in forums and I am finding that there isn't much left worth talking about. So I surmise that only a small fraction of PP DIYers participate actively here.

Bridgewater All-Weather has about $50 Billion or so assets under management..

PRPFX has about $8 billion

Although these are not true implementations of the PP, they pretty much have the same intention: creating a safe and secure portfolio that's relatively insensitive to the economic cycle (in theory).

Even if we include these, I'd estimate less than $100 Billion in total assets are managed under a PP-like strategy.

The PP has not been widely publicized or discussed. Even among those who have heard of it, it is so counter intuitive that it is highly controversial. My guess is that as a percentage of all investors we would be talking about a fraction of a fraction of a percent.

So true, Ad O. Long bonds? No thanks. 25% gold? No, people have been hearing "maybe 5% gold as a hedge against inflation" for too long. So much cash and so little in stocks? Not likely to appeal to many people at first glance.

The Bill Bernstein article gave me the impression that the numbers shift a lot, and I'll bet it's accurate. With the S&P climbing to 1920 and beyond, this could turn out to be a fine time to diversify into non-stock assets. When the market comes down, maybe we'll see a bunch of new adherents wishing aloud that they had done so in '14.

KevinW wrote: My wife and I each have a PP, but she has no interest in forums

@sophie : Same case as in Kevin's household. See Sophie? I did try to add to the female population here, but to no avail. :-/

Updated guesses for the question asked??!!

I'd have no idea how to even guess there are more or less from when the question was initially raised nearly six years ago....

Vinny

Certainly, I do no want to make general conclusions on that matter, but what I can say is that the number of people adhering to PP is much bigger than you might imagine. I am from a small country in Eastern Europe and know several people that apparently got the information for it from somewhere, they have decent level of understanding of it as well (better than mine, I'd say). So, long story - short - do not underestimate the power of knowledge dissemination in the Internet era.

PS. Today I opened new positions for cleaner (on top of what I had already) implementation of PP. Well, the instruments available for me, as an investor are a bit limited, so sometimes even unfunded swap ETFs are 'edible' (think of it, as better than nothing...)

dualstow wrote: ↑Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:26 pm With the S&P climbing to 1920 and beyond, this could turn out to be a fine time to diversify into non-stock assets.

Oh, 2014me, what are you talking about?!
Hanging my head in shame. God bless Pointedstick. He went all equities.

PP fo' life!

It’s all good. I’m still grateful.

People at work have recently learned that I'm really into finance and used to work in the industry.

At a recent meeting one of my coworkers asked to have coffee to chat about investments, and then a bunch of others chimed in.

I'll definitely be introducing a few people to Harry Browne's ideas!

If they end up here, that might be the first case of people knowing each other before they come here.
I mean, I don't know for sure. I just know that we have some threads -- Vinny will find them -- about trying and failing to introduce the pp to family members. Good luck!

dualstow wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2020 7:22 pm If they end up here, that might be the first case of people knowing each other before they come here.
I mean, I don't know for sure. I just know that we have some threads -- Vinny will find them -- about trying and failing to introduce the pp to family members. Good luck!

JUST read one of them! THIS!

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9245&start=12

Vinny