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2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 1:36 pm
by Ad Orientem
MIAMI BEACH — The last 90 seconds of Raymond Herisse’s life unfold on YouTube with chilling clarity.

The car Mr. Herisse, 22, is driving rolls down a South Beach street. Shots are heard in the distance as Hialeah police officers try to stop the car. About two blocks later, the car slows to a stop, standing idle for more than minute. Eight Miami Beach police officers cluster near the driver’s side. Then they unleash a barrage of more than 100 bullets, a volley so startling that the hands of the person recording the scene from his cellphone shake.

In all, 16 bullets hit Mr. Herisse, who was killed sitting behind the wheel. Four bystanders were wounded — two men and two women, part of a large crowd gathered on May 30, 2011, for the final day of Urban Beach Week, a raucous, yearly hip-hop and rap event in South Beach.

But in the two years since Mr. Herisse’s death, his family and the four other victims, increasingly troubled by delays and the police’s handling of the investigation, are still waiting to learn why the officers opened fire on a stopped car amid a throng of onlookers.
Read the rest here...
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/04/us/2- ... ml?hp&_r=0

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 3:45 pm
by Libertarian666
I'm shocked, shocked, that there's government going on here.

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:41 am
by moda0306
Local government. :)

Abolish it!!!

Sorry I'm loving this troll stuff.

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:53 am
by Pointedstick
moda0306 wrote: Local government. :)

Abolish it!!!
I'm so glad you agree! Your anarchist card is in the mail. ;D

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:25 pm
by Ad Orientem
Pointedstick wrote: Your anarchist card is in the mail. ;D
You need to check out the Anarcho-Monarchism blog.

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:33 pm
by Pointedstick
Ad Orientem wrote:
Pointedstick wrote: Your anarchist card is in the mail. ;D
You need to check out the Anarcho-Monarchism blog.
Very interesting stuff.

I found the following passages from their "about us"-type article especially compelling:
Democracy is the ultimate form of socialism in the political sphere.  We all become the government, we all become public property – we all become collectivized.  The same criticisms that apply to socialized property apply to socialized citizens within a democracy.  Collectivized property is over utilized and wasted away simply because no single person or group owns the property; it is merely the property of the ‘people’ and the ‘public.’  Likewise are citizens treated in a modern democratic state.  Citizens are taxed, regulated, controlled, drafted, fined, imprisoned; citizens are nothing but naked resources to the officers of government.  And because of the democratic system, there is never a singular individual that can take the blame for injustices done.  After all, ‘we’ are the people, ‘we’ are the government – the only one to blame for injustice is ‘us.’  So say the Prophets of Democracy.

[...]

The monarch was a person thoroughly different from the nation, not its embodiment or personification, as democratic tyrants claim to be.  The monarch was, notably, a ruler and not a leader.  It is also precisely this ‘other’ quality to monarchs that helped to restrict their power.  If a monarch was perceived as being too unjust, rebellion and even regicide were thought of as moral imperatives for the elites and the commoners alike.  In contrast, democracies view rebellion as the ultimate crime against the State and Society, as since the Leader is the personification of the people itself, only a person at war with himself and nature would seek to overthrow unjust democratic leaders.

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:51 pm
by MediumTex
I like the kind of democracy where if you like something you vote for it by buying it, and if you don't like something you vote against it by not buying it.

***

As far as the guy who got shot, I want to know how when you are a few feet away from a stationary target that is not returning fire you can fire over 100 rounds and only hit your target 16 times. 

I always hear this "chief of police voice" in my head with these stories, and he is talking to the officers involved:

Chief: "Well, fellas, it looks like you killed another civilian.  I know you probably feel bad about it (or maybe you don't), but my job is to spin this thing as best I can so it doesn't take us all down, so I need to know a few things.  First, what the heck were you all thinking when you opened fire on some guy who was sitting in his car?  Second, what's the idea with shooting when you've got onlookers in your line of fire?  Do you know what the term 'onlooker' means?  It means someone who is looking on--it means someone who is watching what you are doing.  You can't shoot these people.  You just can't.  And finally, where did you idiots learn to shoot?  You managed to fire over 100 rounds at a distance of a few feet and managed to hit your target with only 16 of those rounds?  If you guys had been just a little more incompetent that dude would still be alive because you would have missed him completely.  So anyway, I'm going to do what I can with this case.  Maybe we can figure out some way of calling it self-defense or something, or maybe we can just drag the investigation out long enough that people will sort of forget about it.  We'll see."

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:21 pm
by RuralEngineer
I'll not comment on multiple police firing 100+ rounds at a man in a stationary vehicle at point blank range who it was proven by forensic evidence didn't even have a weapon in his hands at the time since it will just get this thread locked.

However:
Obtaining information from the City of Miami Beach and its police department has proved difficult for the victims and Mr. Herisse’s family. They say they were forced to sue to obtain information they are entitled to under the law. Meanwhile, the four bystanders who were seriously injured have not yet been classified as victims — barring them from access to a general fund for victims. They face substantial medical bills.

One victim still has a bullet lodged near his heart; doctors decided not to remove it. Another was shot in the hip and required reconstructive surgery. A third victim was shot in the arm and leg and suffered a nervous breakdown. The fourth person was shot in the arm.
How the hell are the innocent bystanders shot up by this gangland style assassination not being compensated for their injuries?  Regardless of what is going on with the inquiry into the death of the victim in the car, there shouldn't be any doubt regarding these individuals.

This is what is frustrating most about this kind of stuff.  You can't even root for these people because if they take the police department to the cleaners in court after this gets sorted out it's all just taxpayer money.  The only thing that would give anyone any satisfaction is serious CRIMINAL charges against the LEO's involved and we all know that won't ever happen.  It never does.

Re: 2 Years After 116 Police Bullets, Few Answers

Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:42 pm
by MediumTex
RuralEngineer wrote: How the hell are the innocent bystanders shot up by this gangland style assassination not being compensated for their injuries?  Regardless of what is going on with the inquiry into the death of the victim in the car, there shouldn't be any doubt regarding these individuals.

This is what is frustrating most about this kind of stuff.  You can't even root for these people because if they take the police department to the cleaners in court after this gets sorted out it's all just taxpayer money.  The only thing that would give anyone any satisfaction is serious CRIMINAL charges against the LEO's involved and we all know that won't ever happen.  It never does.
What puzzles me is that apparently all of the officers who were firing basically emptied their clips into the car. 

If it had been me, once I heard everyone else shooting I might have just waited to see if another gun was even needed.

What seems to happen with some of these cases is that you ask one cop why he was shooting and he says "Well, the other officers started shooting so I just joined in."