Gyroscopic Investing

Mr. Money Mustache is starting to break through to ever larger audiences. Most recently the Washington Post devoted a large article to the man and his frugal lifestyle. While the article itself was nothing noteworthy for those who read his blog, the responses and comments that it received from readers of that paper were interesting and telling about American's general attitudes towards a life of simplicity and frugality. From the comments I read, I would say 9/10 people took it upon themselves to bash MMM as either a liar or some cult like leader subjecting himself and his family to an impoverished existence of $25,000 dollars a year.

I'm consistently amazed when talking with people about frugal living or the mustachian philosophy how utterly brainwashed they have been to believe that the good of life is to be had through the goods of life and how resistant the average person is to question our society's almost religious devotion to material goods, no matter how much their striving to acquire them impoverishes and robs them of their time and freedom.

I have recently been rereading Walden Pond by Thoreau, and it is funny how similar his line of thinking is with MMM. I think the quote below is as timely and relevant today as it was when it was written over 150 years ago. Then like today, men cling to a common mode of living (no matter how burdensome) forced upon them by social conventions and advertising, instead of thinking for themselves.

The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation. What is called resignation is confirmed desperation. From the desperate city you go into the desperate country, and have to console yourself with the bravery of minks and muskrats. A stereotyped but unconscious despair is concealed even under what are called the games and amusements of mankind. There is no play in them, for this comes after work. But it is a characteristic of wisdom not to do desperate things. When we consider what, to use the words of the catechism, is the chief end of man, and what are the true necessaries and means of life, it appears as if men had deliberately chosen the common mode of living because they preferred it to any other. Yet they honestly think there is no choice left. But alert and healthy natures remember that the sun rose clear. It is never too late to give up our prejudices. No way of thinking or doing, however ancient, can be trusted without proof.

Washington Post article here: http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/ ... questions/

Agreed, Doodle.  The article was quite good at presenting his way of thinking about how there's more to life than work, money, and stuff without making it sound all that unusual or unreasonable.  Even if you have a different viewpoint on life, I don't find anything he said particularly controversial.  To each his own.  Yet the bulk of the comments are remarkable in their deliberateness in tearing down any differing ideas from the "work more, spend more" status quo. 

Part of me holds out hope that blog comments on major sites like that are self-selecting -- the guys who nod in agreement don't touch the keyboard, while the self-defense mechanisms of others compel them to fight.  The alternative is too depressing. 

It's all irrelevant for MMM now. He's easily earning 6-figures+/yr from his blog alone.

Anyone on here can do it. Just requires some prolific writing.

iwealth wrote: It's all irrelevant for MMM now. He's easily earning 6-figures+/yr from his blog alone.

Anyone on here can do it. Just requires some prolific writing.

That reminds me of a quote from a minimalist artist I once saw in a gallery.  One of his sculptures was simply a stack of wooden shipping pallets piled from floor to ceiling and arranged in an interesting spiral pattern.  I don't remember where I heard this quote (perhaps from the owner of the gallery) but a critic complained about the piece saying "I could have done that."  The artist replied "but you didn't."

MMM has become very successful with his blog, but IMHO that doesn't lessen his message about the financial power of simple living.  One of the points I take away from MMM / ERE is that the typical love of material things and resulting dependency on full-time-employment for life robs one of the ability to take a big risk like starting a business, switching careers to something more enjoyable than what you thought you might like when you were a dumb college freshman picking a major, or pouring all your energy into a blog that will most likely never go anywhere.  Financial independence and the resulting ability to brush off failure is one of the greatest building blocks of a successful entrepreneur. 

I do find his investing advice for a more typical early retiree leaves something to be desired and might be shaded by his continuing income, but then again that's why I'm here.  ; ) 

I find most of the investing advice provided on these "early retirement" blogs to be pretty terrible and almost always centered around dividend stock investing and re-investing. Not sure what MMM promotes, but hopefully it's more robust than what I've read on the typical blog in that space.

And you are correct about his message not being diluted due to his blog's success. As long as he can continue to separate the success of his blog with his "anyone can do this" message. Prolific writing ability isn't a part of everyone's skill set. My stating anyone can do it was part serious but also part tongue-in-cheek.

For those who haven't done so yet, I really recommend Walden by Thoreau. It isn't an easy read, but I'm finding it well worth it. To anyone interested in simple living and self sufficiency this is kind of like the Bible. I was particularly surprised by how influenced Thoreau was by eastern philosophy and religion...

As I have started to read more philosophy Im realizing that the MMM / ERE lifestyle is nothing new. Its origin traces back many millennia to people like Epicurus, Epictetus, Seneca, and countless others both from the Eastern and Western traditions.

iwealth wrote: I find most of the investing advice provided on these "early retirement" blogs to be pretty terrible and almost always centered around dividend stock investing and re-investing. Not sure what MMM promotes, but hopefully it's more robust than what I've read on the typical blog in that space.

And you are correct about his message not being diluted due to his blog's success. As long as he can continue to separate the success of his blog with his "anyone can do this" message. Prolific writing ability isn't a part of everyone's skill set. My stating anyone can do it was part serious but also part tongue-in-cheek.

MMM basically used the SP 500 index from Vanguard and a rental house, AFAIK.

This is why MMM is such a great blogger - wonderful turns of phrase.  Sort of like someone we know here??

But it would be nice if the government didn’t subsidize self-destruction quite so heavily, burdening its own citizens with inefficiency.

He goes on to advocate increased gasoline taxes and shifting from income to consumption taxes.  Agree 100%!!

Interestingly, there is a parallel discussion over on the Bogleheads forum with a far different tone than the thread here.  A lot of people seem genuinely angry at his "accomplishments" to the point where they disbelieve his claims.  I'm sure he is hiding many details, but I don't see the basis for the ranting.  There are enough people on this forum who are replicating his results quite successfully (me, among them). 

It's worth a lot to me that I no longer have to worry about whether medical reimbursements will continue to drop, or whether I can keep getting NIH grants - while my colleagues are all in Panic City.  My dept has been threatening to drop us down to base pay (i.e. what an English professor makes) if we don't bring in an amount that I calculate as 5x my current pay.  It's occurred to me that if this were to happen, I'd have the most ideal situation ever:  effectively an enjoyable part time job (since I'd only show up for hospital service, lab meetings and the like) for a pretty decent semi-retirement salary.  Except, I guess, for a slightly larger incidence of nastygrams from administration than we get now.

WiseOne wrote: It's worth a lot to me that I no longer have to worry about whether medical reimbursements will continue to drop, or whether I can keep getting NIH grants - while my colleagues are all in Panic City. 

Panic City is a place I have visited, but I wouldn't want to live there.

Tyler wrote: I don't remember where I heard this quote (perhaps from the owner of the gallery) but a critic complained about the piece saying "I could have done that."  The artist replied "but you didn't."

My NYC-based uncle said that at a museum when I was a kid. All this time, I thought it was his original comment.  Should've known better.

doodle wrote: I'm consistently amazed when talking with people about frugal living or the mustachian philosophy how utterly brainwashed they have been to believe that the good of life is to be had through the goods of life and how resistant the average person is to question our society's almost religious devotion to material goods,

There is a sufi (eastern teaching) story which speaks toward your question.  Story is called "City of Storms".  You can probably find it posted on line, or if not it is in one of the many Idres Shah books of sufi stories.  THe story points out that in order to avoid "storms" i.e. negative emotions people rely on two tried and true remedies 1. to obsess over what they have and 2. to change/acquire new things.  The drive to avoid negative feelings is strong, thus the strong drive to e.g. acquire new things.

dualstow wrote:

Tyler wrote: I don't remember where I heard this quote (perhaps from the owner of the gallery) but a critic complained about the piece saying "I could have done that."  The artist replied "but you didn't."

My NYC-based uncle said that at a museum when I was a kid. All this time, I thought it was his original comment.  Should've known better.

LOL, I say this all the time because I really dig modern art.  It's not meant in a derogatory way, though -- it's more like... I could have done that!  Nevertheless it is also a yardstick by which I measure whether I would purchase said art.  No matter how interesting a circle in the sand is (or whatever), I ain't paying no $5000 if I can easily replicate it at home.

dragoncar wrote: LOL, I say this all the time because I really dig modern art.  It's not meant in a derogatory way, though -- it's more like... I could have done that!  Nevertheless it is also a yardstick by which I measure whether I would purchase said art.  No matter how interesting a circle in the sand is (or whatever), I ain't paying no $5000 if I can easily replicate it at home.

Yep -- I know that feeling exactly.  My favorite art is that which inspires me to try to duplicate it or create something myself. 

dualstow wrote: My NYC-based uncle said that at a museum when I was a kid. All this time, I thought it was his original comment.  Should've known better.

Hey -- I'm going to go ahead and assume the guy stole that line from your uncle.    I know I plan on "borrowing" it when the opportunity arises.

doodle wrote: For those who haven't done so yet, I really recommend Walden by Thoreau.

Free for the iPad, and now downloaded.  Thanks for the recommendation.

WiseOne wrote: It's worth a lot to me that I no longer have to worry about whether medical reimbursements will continue to drop, or whether I can keep getting NIH grants - while my colleagues are all in Panic City.  My dept has been threatening to drop us down to base pay (i.e. what an English professor makes) if we don't bring in an amount that I calculate as 5x my current pay.  It's occurred to me that if this were to happen, I'd have the most ideal situation ever:  effectively an enjoyable part time job (since I'd only show up for hospital service, lab meetings and the like) for a pretty decent semi-retirement salary.  Except, I guess, for a slightly larger incidence of nastygrams from administration than we get now.

We know you're somewhere in the bowels of the medical-academic-industrial-complex, but what exactly is it you do?

Tyler wrote:

doodle wrote: For those who haven't done so yet, I really recommend Walden by Thoreau.

Free for the iPad, and now downloaded.  Thanks for the recommendation.

Cool! You might also want to check out Walden Two by the behavioral psychologist B.F. Skinner. I had to read it back in college. It is an interesting story of a fictional community built around the idea that human behavior is largely deterministic and that by altering the environment that people live in a utopia could be constructed. I actually think it might be interesting to do a read and discuss in this forum with that book.