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Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:10 pm
by Gumby
If you're sick of your bank, here's a new and interesting option. "Simple" is a new vision for banking online. It's not a bank, it's a card and a very impressive online/mobile banking platform. They store your money in an FDIC-insured partner bank — without any of the annoying fees.

They just started accepting new customers...

https://www.simple.com

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:37 pm
by AdamA
Interesting...

I don't really understand the concept of a "bank partner."  Do you?

Also--how do they make their money?

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:52 am
by Storm
It seems like they don't pay any interest (at least that I can tell) so they probably make their money by keeping the interest generated by your money in the partner bank's account.

Personally, I'm not going to sign up because it's just another intermediary between my money and the bank (I already worry enough about a bank run and the FDIC backstop, now I have to worry about a startup going out of business?).  Also, if a bank wants my money, they need to offer me compelling reasons like interest, refunding ATM fees, free checks, etc.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:12 pm
by Gumby
It's obviously not safer than a bank. It's just more convenient. If I was going to use such a product, I certainly wouldn't store very much cash with it. If nothing else, I think it will raise the bar of what online banking should be like:

Here is some info from their FAQ:
The Basics

What is Simple? Are you a bank?
Simple is not a bank. Simple replaces your bank. We give you the services and support you need to manage, understand, and automate your everyday spending and saving. Meanwhile, your cash is deposited with our bank partners in FDIC-insured products.

Through Simple, you can deposit checks using your smartphone, set up direct deposit, earn interest, pay bills, transfer money, make purchases with your Simple Visa® card, withdraw cash from over 40,000 ATMs, and more. We offer beautifully-designed web and mobile apps, no surprise fees, and real customer service.

We take care of you, the banks take care of your money, and jointly, we've designed a better financial experience.

Simple is built by Simple Finance Technology Corp.

Can I use Simple with my current bank?
No. Through your relationship with Simple, your money is held in an FDIC-insured account at one of our bank partners. We make it easy for you to transfer money from your existing bank. If you have questions or run into any problems, our customer relations team is available to help you.

Are you like Mint?
No. Simple replaces your current banking relationship. We do not aggregate accounts across multiple financial institutions into a single view.

Unlike personal financial management tools that rely on third parties, your Simple Visa® card gets much richer data directly from the transaction processor. With better data, Simple can better categorize your transactions, show you more accurate merchant names, and make it all searchable. Pretty neat, right?

Also, we hate pie charts.

What about fees?
Simple does not profit from fees. We believe that sort of business model creates an adversarial relationship between banks and their customers, since the bank benefits when customers make mistakes. That's not right. We're adamant about minimizing fees and never penalizing our customers.

This means:
  • No hidden fees, no monthly debit card fees, account maintenance fees, low balance fees, overdraft fees, or anything of that sort; and
  • No fees for domestic funds transfers, or for using another bank's ATM.
The only time you might ever incur charges from Simple is when the service you request is too expensive for us to cover (e.g. international wire transfers). In these cases, we only charge you what the service costs to provide.

If you don't profit from fees, how does Simple make money?
Since Simple is exclusively online, we don't need to build or maintain any expensive storefronts. This keeps our costs down, avoiding the need to profit from fees. Simple makes money in two ways, interest margin and interchange:
  • Interest margin is revenue a bank earns from loans, less the interest the bank pays its customers on deposits. For example, if a bank earns 8% interest on its loans and pays 3% interest on its customers' deposits, the interest margin would be 5%. Our partner banks split this interest margin with us.
  • Interchange is revenue earned by a card-issuing bank when customers make purchases using that bank's card. Our bank partners split this interchange revenue with us.
Why did you change your name from BankSimple?
Please read our blog post about why we changed our name.

Requirements, Security, Privacy

Who can use Simple?
To be eligible, you must:
  • Be a resident of the United States and over the age of 18;
  • Have a Social Security number; and
  • Own a smartphone (iPhone or Android).
Do I really need to have a smartphone?
Well, you need to have an iOS (version 4.2 or higher) or Android device. Android phones and iPhones are preferable so that you can deposit checks using your smartphone's camera and receive push notifications when you buy things. Would you like to use Simple on a different device? Let us know at hello@simple.com.

Are my deposits insured by the FDIC?
Yes. All deposits are made with our partner banks and insured up to the FDIC limit (currently $250,000). FDIC insurance guarantees the safety of your deposits.

What is your security policy?
Security is fundamental to Simple. We use a variety of methods to secure our network and servers as well as our software and web applications. Our data retention and business continuity plans are comprehensive and our employees maintain organization security measures designed to keep your data safe.

How do you handle my personal information?
We will never sell, rent or loan any personal information that you provide to us. Simple.

Launching and Getting Invited

When are you launching?
We have already started bringing our first customers onboard, but Simple is only available in limited release at this time. If you are interested, you can request an invitation to the limited release. We are inviting customers to join us on a first-come, first-served basis.

Why haven't I received my invite yet?
We are sending out invites for the limited release, but starting slowly. If you've already requested an invite, then you are all set. Hang in there! We appreciate your patience.

Using Simple

What features will you provide?
We give you the services and support you need to manage, understand, and automate your everyday spending and saving. Meanwhile, your cash is deposited with our bank partners in FDIC-insured products.

As a Simple customer, you receive a Simple Visa® card that is issued by our partner bank. You also get access to our website and free mobile applications. With Simple, you can make purchases both in stores and online, deposit checks using your smartphone, set up direct deposit, earn interest via our partner bank, pay bills, transfer money, withdraw cash from ATMs, and more. In addition, Simple Goals help you save for anything and manage your finances. And if that's not enough, our Safe-to-Spend™ feature offers a uniquely clear picture of your available funds.

What kind of card is the Simple card?
The Simple Visa® card is a debit card issued by our partner bank. You can use it at any merchant worldwide that accepts Visa. Because it is a debit card, you can only spend up to your total balance. If you attempt to make a transaction larger than your balance, your card will be declined. We do not charge overdraft fees.

Does Simple offer bill pay?
Yes. You can either send money via electronic payments or have a paper check mailed to your payee.

How do I deposit checks?
The easiest and quickest way is by setting up direct deposit through your employer. We provide you your routing and account numbers at our partner bank, and then your funds are automatically deposited there. Have a check? Just take a photo of it with your smartphone and the check will be deposited by our bank partner into your account. Piece of cake. Of course, you can also mail in a check or money order. In the future, we may offer desktop scanning of checks as well.

How's the ATM access?
We work with the country's largest fee-free ATM network, with over 40,000 locations nationwide. That's roughly twice the number of the nation's largest bank. You'll be able to locate ATMs within our mobile app, and wherever you are there should be no shortage of fee-free ATMs available. You can also request cash back at thousands of merchants when you use your Simple card.

How do I deposit cash?
Surprisingly, you can visit any bank branch to deposit cash into your account. We'll provide you with the steps you need to take to deposit your money into our partner bank, and how you may need to instruct the teller. The depositing bank may charge you for this. While a bit roundabout, you can also turn the cash into a cashier's check, money order, etc., and deposit it via our mobile app. You can put it under your mattress, too.

Does Simple integrate with budgeting programs like Quicken? Can I export my Simple data?
You can easily export your Simple data in .csv format to your budgeting software of choice. You can also download your monthly statements in .pdf format.

Does Simple integrate with Mint or PayPal?
You can link Simple to Mint or PayPal in the same way you would link to any other online financial service. Simple also provides budgeting and savings tools and the ability to send payments via email.

Does Simple offer competitive interest rates?
Interest rates are nominal almost anywhere you look these days, but our bank partner offers competitive rates. And as the economy improves, rates will likely rise. While our bank partner's rates are competitive, if you're primarily seeking high-yield savings, Simple probably isn't the best option for you. Keep in mind that institutions offering sky-high interest rates usually pay for those rates through fees, balance requirements or spending requirements – all of which run counter to our philosophy.

Does Simple rebate ATM fees?
If you use an out-of-network ATM, we will never charge you, but the ATM owner may, and we don't rebate that fee. With over 40,000 fee-free ATMs in our network and thousands of merchants offering cash back, you should be able to easily avoid fees. Though we anticipate that our customers would prefer we not subsidize the big banks, we would consider an ATM fee rebate program if customers don't find our system convenient.

While we do not mark up the cost of international ATMs, they do cost Simple two to three times as much as domestic ATMs. When providing you access to international ATMs, we only charge you what it costs us.

Does Simple offer rewards programs?
We don't currently offer a rewards or points program, as these programs are often funded through extra fees. Instead, we focus on offering customers a great product and excellent service. If customers make a strong case for a rewards program, we will consider offering one. Please let us know your thoughts at hello@simple.com.

What about...

Will you offer credit cards, brokerage accounts, CDs, mortgages, or loans?
Right now, we're focusing on the basics. But we know our customers' financial lives are multi-faceted, so we plan to offer other products and services through our bank partners in the future.

Will you offer small business accounts?
We don't offer a product for small businesses yet, but through our partner banks we would like to serve small business customers in the future. Please let us know what you would love to see in a small business offering at hello@simple.com.

Is Simple expanding to other countries beyond the United States?
Not yet. Expanding internationally isn't trivial due to the laws and regulations that are unique to every country. We know there is international interest and we look forward to serving customers outside of the United States once we're established in the US.

Does Simple support joint accounts?
We don't currently offer joint access to Simple. However, we know you don't live in a vacuum, and we plan to allow you and a partner to share Simple in the not-too-distant future. If you are interested in this feature, we want to hear from you. Please send us your thoughts at hello@simple.com.

Does Simple provide an API?
Yes, we are building it now. Please join our API Google Group for more information.

Why haven't you answered X?
If there is anything you'd like answered, or if you just want to share your ideas, feel free to shoot us an email at hello@simple.com.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:16 pm
by MediumTex
It sounds like this might be a good place to deposit Bitcoin earnings.

Who are their partner banks?

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:24 pm
by Gumby
From reading their blog posts, they have been critical of big banks and their fee-based strategies. They say that they have been reaching out to small community banks that want more accounts and are willing to allow Simple's technology manage the accounts securely. The idea is that the newer technology will lower the costs for the banks, and the banks will learn a few technology improvements from Simple.

Simple isn't a bank. It's just a banking platform that interacts with pre-chosen FDIC-insured banks that are set up to use the service.

I'm very happy with my small community bank, and don't plan on using the service. But, if I was unable to find a high quality community bank in my area, I think I would consider it. I'm just impressed with Simple's consumer-friendly technology.

Here's a video demo you can watch:

http://www.simple.com/blog/Simple/a-fir ... ankSimple/

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:58 pm
by Gumby
Ah... here we go.
BankSimple customers’ deposits will be held in FDIC-insured products at The Bancorp Bank and CBW Bank. We take great care in selecting our partner banks. Beyond having rock-solid balance sheets, our bank partners must meet two specific criteria. First and foremost, our partners must share our vision. That means no surprise fees and full transparency into product terms and conditions. Second, our bank partners must support modern real-time systems that enable deep connectivity with the BankSimple platform. Our partnership with Andera will help us rapidly bring new bank partners onboard and streamline the account opening process for our customers. We are excited about our partnerships with The Bancorp Bank, CBW Bank, and Andera and we look forward to announcing additional partners soon.
http://www.simple.com/blog/Simple/partners-funding/

So, those are the first banking partners. They claim to be adding more banking partners as they grow.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:42 am
by smurff
It's just an intermediary between a bank and me. Another layer separating my money from me.

I like my phone but if the only way I can do transactions is using the smartyphone forget about it. Too many chances that something will go wrong. What if I lose the phone?  And with the various financial insurance agencies effectively repudiating their coverage, what if the non-bank or the community bank collapses?  Will FDIC pass-through insurance cover accounts enrolled via non-bank entities?

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:46 am
by smurff
Oh--and they make their money through interest and fees, just like banks.

Nothing wrong with that--except when marketing materials try to make it look like that's not what's happening.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:15 pm
by Storm
My bank has 2 local branches within 2 miles of me, and for zero fees, pays a ridiculously small amount of interest on checking (I think it was 0.15% last time I checked) as well as 0.5% on savings...

But... for maintaining a combined balance of $10K between all my accounts, I get:
  • Free checks printed and replacements.
  • Free safe deposit box.
  • Free online bill payment.
  • Unlimited refunded ATM fees anywhere in the world.  We tested this in China and Taiwan - they even refunded the $100 Taiwan dollars fee (about $3.25 USD) for withdrawing $1000 Taiwan dollars from a 7-11 there.
  • Free money orders/cashier checks.
  • No foreign transaction fees on debit cards.
  • 1% cashback on debit card transactions.
  • 0.25% off your mortgage interest if you pay with auto-debit from your checking account.  Their mortgage rates are already competitive with any other mortgage lender, but with an extra quarter point off, it's actually the best mortgage rate I've seen.
I think Simple would have to offer some really compelling thing besides just an iPhone app to get my business.  I'd rather get all of the free services or extra cash back.  Honestly, I don't understand why people use Bank of America and pay for the privilege of using a debit card - banks get transaction fees for each debit card purchase so THEY SHOULD BE PAYING YOU for the privilege of getting those fees, not the other way around.

In fact, I would love to bank somewhere where a bank manager would call me on the phone and say "thank you for buying that flat screen TV at Best Buy last week with your debit card; we appreciate the $50 in transaction fees you made for us, and have upgraded you to super platinum preferred because you're such a great customer."

Hey, I can dream, can't I?  ;D

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:38 pm
by Indices
Their website looks like a poorly done wordpress site. I watched one of their videos and with the echo in the background it is clear they shot it on their own computer vs. a professional studio. Not a lot of money behind this operation.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:51 pm
by Gumby
smurff wrote:It's just an intermediary between a bank and me. Another layer separating my money from me.
I Agree. It's not for everyone. I'm just impressed by the technology. Most banks have very antiquated technology to manage your money.
smurff wrote:I like my phone but if the only way I can do transactions is using the smartyphone forget about it. Too many chances that something will go wrong. What if I lose the phone?
If you've set up your smart phone properly, it will wipe itself clean when lost (as my iPhone does). This isn't difficult to do.
smurff wrote:And with the various financial insurance agencies effectively repudiating their coverage, what if the non-bank or the community bank collapses?  Will FDIC pass-through insurance cover accounts enrolled via non-bank entities?
The accounts should be in your name, but you're right. It's obviously worth investigating. I don't see the harm in using Simple with a very small amount of spending cash if you're looking for convenience.
smurff wrote: Oh--and they make their money through interest and fees, just like banks.

Nothing wrong with that--except when marketing materials try to make it look like that's not what's happening.
What fees? They clearly state that they make their money from "Interest margin" and "Interchange" revenue. Unlike most banks, there are no hidden fees. That's their business model. They've actually designed the user interface to help their depositors avoid any fees.
Storm wrote:banks get transaction fees for each debit card purchase so THEY SHOULD BE PAYING YOU for the privilege of getting those fees, not the other way around.

In fact, I would love to bank somewhere where a bank manager would call me on the phone and say "thank you for buying that flat screen TV at Best Buy last week with your debit card; we appreciate the $50 in transaction fees you made for us, and have upgraded you to super platinum preferred because you're such a great customer."

Hey, I can dream, can't I?   ;D
It sounds like you aren't familiar with the Durbin amendment. Since October 2010, US banks hardly make any money off of Interchange fees anymore. That's why those banks have had to resort to hidden fees so much.
The Durbin Amendment also gave the Federal Reserve the power to regulate debit card interchange fees, and on December 16, 2010 the Fed proposed a maximum interchange fee of 12 cents per debit card transaction, which CardHub.com estimated would cost large banks $14 billion annually. On June 29, 2011, the Fed issued its final rule, which holds that the maximum interchange fee an issuer can receive from a single debit card transaction is 21 cents plus 5 basis points multiplied by the amount of the transaction. This rule also allows issuers to raise their interchange fees by as much as one cent if they implement certain fraud-prevention measures. An issuer eligible for this adjustment, could therefore receive an interchange fee of as much as 24 cents for the average debit card transaction (valued at $38), according to the Federal Reserve. This cap — which will take effect on October 1, 2011 rather than July 21, 2011 as was previously announced — will reduce fees roughly $9.4 billion annually, according to CardHub.com. As a result of the government limiting their revenue from interchange fees, banks made plans to raise account maintenance fees to compensate.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodd–Frank ... ection_Act
Simple is just a service that attempts to make banking more consumer-friendly — by removing the hidden fees that banks have relied on. It's not perfect.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:58 pm
by Gumby
Indices wrote: Their website looks like a poorly done wordpress site. I watched one of their videos and with the echo in the background it is clear they shot it on their own computer vs. a professional studio. Not a lot of money behind this operation.
Simple is a small startup with $13.1 Million in seed funding.

http://www.crunchbase.com/company/banksimple

Their co-founder is one of the original developers of Twitter — arguably one of the most important web technologies on the planet.

Simple is clearly geared towards a younger demographic. Why are you pooping all over a small startup that's trying to make the interface to banking more consumer-friendly? This is how change happens.

Would you prefer that banking never change?

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 1:15 pm
by Storm
Gumby wrote: It sounds like you aren't familiar with the Durbin amendment. Since October 2010, US banks hardly make any money off of Interchange fees anymore. That's why those banks have had to resort to hidden fees so much.
The Durbin Amendment also gave the Federal Reserve the power to regulate debit card interchange fees, and on December 16, 2010 the Fed proposed a maximum interchange fee of 12 cents per debit card transaction, which CardHub.com estimated would cost large banks $14 billion annually. On June 29, 2011, the Fed issued its final rule, which holds that the maximum interchange fee an issuer can receive from a single debit card transaction is 21 cents plus 5 basis points multiplied by the amount of the transaction. This rule also allows issuers to raise their interchange fees by as much as one cent if they implement certain fraud-prevention measures. An issuer eligible for this adjustment, could therefore receive an interchange fee of as much as 24 cents for the average debit card transaction (valued at $38), according to the Federal Reserve. This cap — which will take effect on October 1, 2011 rather than July 21, 2011 as was previously announced — will reduce fees roughly $9.4 billion annually, according to CardHub.com. As a result of the government limiting their revenue from interchange fees, banks made plans to raise account maintenance fees to compensate.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodd–Frank ... ection_Act
Simple is just a service that attempts to make banking more consumer-friendly — by removing the hidden fees that banks have relied on. It's not perfect.
Actually, I am familiar with the Durbin amendment.  When I said debit card, I should have said "debit card as a credit transaction", which actually earns the banks much larger fees, as much as 2.9% of the total purchase price.  Even when I use my debit card as a true debit card (with PIN) transaction, they're still getting a few cents, but if I use it as a credit card, they get a whopping 2.x%!  And for this privilege, they want to charge a monthly fee?  If BofA was smart they would be paying customers to use their debit card as a credit card (make 5 credit transactions each month and get $10 deposited into your account).

I'm just fed up with banks that want to charge us for the privilege of making them money.  When you research and find out how much money they are making off of you, it makes you kind of mad that they want to charge you a fee as well.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 1:20 pm
by Gumby
Storm wrote:I'm just fed up with banks that want to charge us for the privilege of making them money.  When you research and find out how much money they are making off of you, it makes you kind of mad that they want to charge you a fee as well.
I completely agree. It's criminal.

All I was saying is that Simple is an interesting solution because they aren't a bank — they are trying to help consumers avoid fees with a consumer-driven interface that encourages its users to save and discourages them from spending beyond their "safe to spend" limits.

A real bank purposefully does just the opposite to create most of its revenue. A real bank wants you to overspend beyond your limits so that they can charge you more fees. (Despite all this, I'm a strong believer in small community banks, as they do have an incentive to keep your business, and their customer service tends to be very good. I feel lucky to have found a good one).

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 6:18 pm
by Indices
Gumby wrote:
Indices wrote: Their website looks like a poorly done wordpress site. I watched one of their videos and with the echo in the background it is clear they shot it on their own computer vs. a professional studio. Not a lot of money behind this operation.
Simple is a small startup with $13.1 Million in seed funding.

http://www.crunchbase.com/company/banksimple

Their co-founder is one of the original developers of Twitter — arguably one of the most important web technologies on the planet.

Simple is clearly geared towards a younger demographic. Why are you pooping all over a small startup that's trying to make the interface to banking more consumer-friendly? This is how change happens.

Would you prefer that banking never change?
13.1 million is extremely small funding for a financial institution. I would prefer not to have my money with a company that small and not making a profit.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 7:32 pm
by Gumby
Indices wrote:13.1 million is extremely small funding for a financial institution.
It isn't a financial institution. They aren't a bank. They have no legal right to your money. They don't hold any accounts. They aren't even licensed to hold any accounts.

It's just an interface that interacts with your money. It's just an app that moves your money around.

Nearly every small community bank outsources its online banking to small internet companies you've never heard of. So, when you log into your small community bank's online banking website, you're really logging into a small 3rd party service (such as netteller.com or orcc.com). The only difference with Simple is that you get to choose the 3rd party service to interact with your money.

Re: Simple: It's not a bank

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 8:39 am
by Storm
Gumby wrote:
Indices wrote:13.1 million is extremely small funding for a financial institution.
It isn't a financial institution. They aren't a bank. They have no legal right to your money. They don't hold any accounts. They aren't even licensed to hold any accounts.

It's just an interface that interacts with your money. It's just an app that moves your money around.

Nearly every small community bank outsources its online banking to small internet companies you've never heard of. So, when you log into your small community bank's online banking website, you're really logging into a small 3rd party service (such as netteller.com or orcc.com). The only difference with Simple is that you get to choose the 3rd party service to interact with your money.
Thanks for clearing that up, Gumby.  I assumed they were some type of intermediary that had access to your money, but it seems like they are similar to Mint, but with better integration with the banks.  It might be a really cool system - I do like their saving thing, however, I don't really save like that ($10 a week and I can afford an iPad) - this seems like a good way for students to save.  Personally I make a cost/benefit decision and just buy something if I need it, but this is because I have a lot saved already.