Still that doesn’t hold up to scrutiny. Fauci and other “experts” have claimed repeatedly that wearing a mask is the number one way to stop the virus. So even with less than 100% compliance,you certainly have an extremely higher rate of mask wearing now than you had in April or May when mandates weren't in effect in Texas or California. So why haven’t case numbers dropped in proportion to the increased mask usage?Tortoise wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:19 pmNo place ever quite has 100% mask compliance, so no matter how much the cases skyrocket, one can always claim that it would have skyrocketed even more had there been 100% compliance.jalanlong wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:59 pm If masks are so darn effective and every major city in this country has mask mandates, why are cases spiking? Why is California a hotspot when they were claiming to be the #1 most compliant state with mask wearing. What will a National mask mandate do for increasing cases in those states that already have mask mandates?
Sort of like when we have big financial crashes even though the Fed has existed for ages. One can always claim the crashes would have been considerably worse without the Fed.
Coronavirus General Discussion
Moderator: Global Moderator
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
- Cortopassi
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
Million dollar question.jalanlong wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:27 pmStill that doesn’t hold up to scrutiny. Fauci and other “experts” have claimed repeatedly that wearing a mask is the number one way to stop the virus. So even with less than 100% compliance,you certainly have an extremely higher rate of mask wearing now than you had in April or May when mandates weren't in effect in Texas or California. So why haven’t case numbers dropped in proportion to the increased mask usage?Tortoise wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:19 pmNo place ever quite has 100% mask compliance, so no matter how much the cases skyrocket, one can always claim that it would have skyrocketed even more had there been 100% compliance.jalanlong wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:59 pm If masks are so darn effective and every major city in this country has mask mandates, why are cases spiking? Why is California a hotspot when they were claiming to be the #1 most compliant state with mask wearing. What will a National mask mandate do for increasing cases in those states that already have mask mandates?
Sort of like when we have big financial crashes even though the Fed has existed for ages. One can always claim the crashes would have been considerably worse without the Fed.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
They're learning from China. China controls a billion people with their surveillance/mask/curfew/police state
https://www.reddit.com/r/China/comments ... _state_as/
Politicians arent heart broken about grandmas. Most people who enter a nursing home are dead within two years.
https://www.reddit.com/r/China/comments ... _state_as/
Politicians arent heart broken about grandmas. Most people who enter a nursing home are dead within two years.
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
Correction--They BUILT China's surveillance/mask/police state.boglerdude wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 3:33 am They're learning from China. China controls a billion people with their surveillance/mask/curfew/police state
https://www.reddit.com/r/China/comments ... _state_as/
Politicians arent heart broken about grandmas. Most people who enter a nursing home are dead within two years.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
I see less than half the people in my area wearing masks, unless you count wearing it around their neck. They slip it on before going into a place of business that requires it. Plenty of chances to spread it around.
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
That is a question that never seems to be asked of either politicians like Biden or medical authorities like Fauci. If masks are so darn effective and every major city in this country has mask mandates, why are cases spiking? Why is California a hotspot when they were claiming to be the #1 most compliant state with mask wearing. What will a National mask mandate do for increasing cases in those states that already have mask mandates?jalanlong wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:59 pm don't understand how, for example, a place like NY, where I assume people are very compliant with mask wearing, has these big surges? Did everyone just stop wearing masks? Everyone get fatigue at the same time? Do masks not really work? Is it getting confounded with the flu and news outlets/governments are not being open about that? These are the questions in my mind.
[/quote]
I've noticed that mask wearing has gotten much more prevalent than it was over the summer. They're a lot less uncomfortable in cold weather, but maybe also it's due to the mask indoctrination. So yes, that certainly begs the question of why cases are increasing while mask wearing has also increased, or at least not decreased.
I suspect there is a lot of confounding by normal colds & flu. Last year, if you got sick you either medicated yourself to the hilt and went to work sick if that was the culture in your workplace, or you stayed home with a box of tissues and watched TV. This year, if you get sick you immediately go stand on a long line to get a COVID test. We already know that a percentage of these will come up positive reasons having nothing to do with current, active COVID infection. The positives are then labeled as COVID cases.
I don't think anyone has attempted to account for this scenario. Especially in NYC where about 20% of the population turns up positive on antibody testing. Perhaps a study of the rapid antigen & PCR tests in these antibody positive cases would help give some idea of what proportion of the population would turn up with a positive test based on prior infection (as I recall, that was the case with the famous George Floyd). Let's say that's just 10% of them. If that's so, and if everyone has equal probability of catching a random cold and deciding to get tested, then you would expect 2% of COVID tests to come back positive because of prior infection. Amazingly enough, the % positive test rate in NYC is about 2.5%. Interesting, no????
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
I think that’s mostly true, but the devil is in the details. If two of the kind of people who only wear the mask for the bare minimum — not judging here — meet on the street and end up having a sustained conversation, are they more likely or less likely to take a step back and/or put on a mask?
I’m not concerned (anymore) about people who pass by without a mask because you’re right. But...the virus continues to spread like wildfire so *someone’s* doing it wrong.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
I've noticed that mask wearing has gotten much more prevalent than it was over the summer. They're a lot less uncomfortable in cold weather, but maybe also it's due to the mask indoctrination. So yes, that certainly begs the question of why cases are increasing while mask wearing has also increased, or at least not decreased.WiseOne wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:42 pmThat is a question that never seems to be asked of either politicians like Biden or medical authorities like Fauci. If masks are so darn effective and every major city in this country has mask mandates, why are cases spiking? Why is California a hotspot when they were claiming to be the #1 most compliant state with mask wearing. What will a National mask mandate do for increasing cases in those states that already have mask mandates?jalanlong wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:59 pm don't understand how, for example, a place like NY, where I assume people are very compliant with mask wearing, has these big surges? Did everyone just stop wearing masks? Everyone get fatigue at the same time? Do masks not really work? Is it getting confounded with the flu and news outlets/governments are not being open about that? These are the questions in my mind.
I suspect there is a lot of confounding by normal colds & flu. Last year, if you got sick you either medicated yourself to the hilt and went to work sick if that was the culture in your workplace, or you stayed home with a box of tissues and watched TV. This year, if you get sick you immediately go stand on a long line to get a COVID test. We already know that a percentage of these will come up positive reasons having nothing to do with current, active COVID infection. The positives are then labeled as COVID cases.
I don't think anyone has attempted to account for this scenario. Especially in NYC where about 20% of the population turns up positive on antibody testing. Perhaps a study of the rapid antigen & PCR tests in these antibody positive cases would help give some idea of what proportion of the population would turn up with a positive test based on prior infection (as I recall, that was the case with the famous George Floyd). Let's say that's just 10% of them. If that's so, and if everyone has equal probability of catching a random cold and deciding to get tested, then you would expect 2% of COVID tests to come back positive because of prior infection. Amazingly enough, the % positive test rate in NYC is about 2.5%. Interesting, no????
[/quote]
A week ago today, when I spent about 8 hours in fairly close proximity with two other people, there was also their dog with them. As soon as they arrived at my house I asked them if they wanted to go to the dog park in the town next to me. They said yes.
We went. I'd only prior been in it for a few minutes before one of my softball games (our two fields are next to it). This time I immersed myself in it, taking pictures of the myriad of the dogs (plus sometimes their owners). Because it looked like every single person in the dog park was wearing a mask, I thought I should have mine on. I put it on when I got inside the dog park.
When I take pictures I do not use the big viewer on the back of the camera but, instead, always use the tiny viewfinder.
I was taking my first pictures and manually focusing. Just before I was going to snap the picture, the view finder would get totally fogged. It initially threw me as I was wondering why of a sudden something that had never happened before was now happening, which I thought was my eye steaming up the viewfinder. Why???
Finally, after a few seconds, I realized it was the mask and the steam coming from my nose.
Solved the problem by bringing the mask below my nose. Problem solved. No one complained about that nose exposure. There were both quite a few people and dogs there (more dogs since it seemed like many people had multiple dogs).
Also, if Pugchief is reading this...
In addition to the two dog parks being next to our field...there is also a child's playground, a covered area with benches for eating, a basketball court, and.....finally, a pickle ball court!
I am almost certain I'd hardly ever seen anyone using it while we were at our softball games. The rare times there had been anyone there I never paid any close attention because I was too wrapped up in my softball games.
When we got there, as usual, there was no one on the that pickle ball court.
However, when we were leaving there were four people playing. I think one of them was older and the other three might have been late 20s, early 30s.
The three of us stood just outside the court fence for a while watching them play. This group did not seem all that athletic as I did not seem to see the ball go back and forth more than twice and did not seem to see that much movement on the part of any of them. It seemed like it was no more exercise than playing softball, which is not much. It felt to me like I could have jumped right in and played at least as well as any of the four of them.
Vinny
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Were we the only ones to get the unseasonably upper 60s, lower 70s weather for about five straight days? That was the last good day. That day I was wearing shorts and sandals.
Vinny
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Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
No, it's been like that every day here for quite a while! I don't know why all the national media is talking about people wanting to be inside.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
But you are in Texas. After last Tuesday it is a good chance I will not be outside again until March!Xan wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:26 pmNo, it's been like that every day here for quite a while! I don't know why all the national media is talking about people wanting to be inside.
Vinny
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
Yea this is definitely the nice part of the year in Texas. Maybe another month until the ice-rains start.
Vinny, one thing that might help you be able to go outside in our non-Texas climate is simply putting on some warm clothes. A lot of people don't know this trick, but it works really well. You can actually go outside all year!
You there, Ephialtes. May you live forever.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
Sounds fishy. I’m skeptical.Kriegsspiel wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:22 am ...
Vinny, one thing that might help you be able to go outside in our non-Texas climate is simply putting on some warm clothes. A lot of people don't know this trick, but it works really well. You can actually go outside all year!
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And, what exactly would I do?Kriegsspiel wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:22 amYea this is definitely the nice part of the year in Texas. Maybe another month until the ice-rains start.
Vinny, one thing that might help you be able to go outside in our non-Texas climate is simply putting on some warm clothes. A lot of people don't know this trick, but it works really well. You can actually go outside all year!
For me my top on my property outside activity in sitting in a chair in the sun while reading and listening to music.
There is nothing I want to be doing outside in the cold.
Vinny
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
What do you do? WHAT DO YOU DO?! I'll tell you, bucko! You go out there, in the snow flurries, in that whipping wind, and you READ your GODDAMN BOOK! Did your ancestors battle the elements, cross the oceans, or beat a saber tooth tiger to death with their own child (not your ancestor) only to see you defeated by modestly cool weather?! NAY, I SAY. NAY. This is no longer about a delightful afternoon in the sunshine, it's about proving that you're tougher than you think you are. Now go enjoy this bracing weather! I went for a walk this morning (just a tad below freezing temperatures, very pleasant) in shorts just to burn off some estrogen brought on by herbal tea drinking.
You there, Ephialtes. May you live forever.
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Kriegsspiel wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:37 am What do you do? WHAT DO YOU DO?! I'll tell you, bucko! You go out there, in the snow flurries, in that whipping wind, and you READ your GODDAMN BOOK! Did your ancestors battle the elements, cross the oceans, or beat a saber tooth tiger to death with their own child (not your ancestor) only to see you defeated by modestly cool weather?! NAY, I SAY. NAY. This is no longer about a delightful afternoon in the sunshine, it's about proving that you're tougher than you think you are. Now go enjoy this bracing weather! I went for a walk this morning (just a tad below freezing temperatures, very pleasant) in shorts just to burn off some estrogen brought on by herbal tea drinking.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
EXTREMELY well done!
Weird Al Yankovic - When I Was Your Age [Lyrics]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LQWFDo604o
Vinny
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
In YOUR honor AND inspired by YOU....I decided when just going out to get my mail / newspaper across the street from my house....I'd only wear T-shirt, hooded sweatshirt, and shorts.Kriegsspiel wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:37 am What do you do? WHAT DO YOU DO?! I'll tell you, bucko! You go out there, in the snow flurries, in that whipping wind, and you READ your GODDAMN BOOK! Did your ancestors battle the elements, cross the oceans, or beat a saber tooth tiger to death with their own child (not your ancestor) only to see you defeated by modestly cool weather?! NAY, I SAY. NAY. This is no longer about a delightful afternoon in the sunshine, it's about proving that you're tougher than you think you are. Now go enjoy this bracing weather! I went for a walk this morning (just a tad below freezing temperatures, very pleasant) in shorts just to burn off some estrogen brought on by herbal tea drinking.
It was cold! Especially with the wind cutting right through my sweatshirt.
I was now shocked to go to weather.com see how cold it really is outside.
31! With the 13 mph wind it feels like 22!
My legs are still cold.
Doing my 100 pushups now should warm up my entire body.
Vinny
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
Oh you're one of thoseKriegsspiel wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:37 am ...! I went for a walk this morning (just a tad below freezing temperatures, very pleasant) in shorts
..
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
MI Gov. Whitmer is likely going to be impeached, and my guess is that PA Gov. Wolf may be heading in the same direction.
Both of their states' courts ruled their lockdowns and restrictions to be unconstitutional, yet both of them are ignoring the court rulings.
Both of their states' courts ruled their lockdowns and restrictions to be unconstitutional, yet both of them are ignoring the court rulings.
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Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
Outstanding! I hope they can pull this off. This insanity needs to stop. Regardless of how important Whitmer thinks lockdowns are, she still can't make laws that can destroy livelihoods and put people in jail by executive order.MangoMan wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:49 pmThat would be awesome. Standing up to these tyrants is mandatory. Now if only Newsom, Cuomo and Pritzker would take a hint...Tortoise wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:00 pm MI Gov. Whitmer is likely going to be impeached, and my guess is that PA Gov. Wolf may be heading in the same direction.
Both of their states' courts ruled their lockdowns and restrictions to be unconstitutional, yet both of them are ignoring the court rulings.
It's interesting that so many of the swing states that Trump lost, and even deep blue ones like California, went Republican on everything from Congress to state legislatures to ballot initiatives. I think this is one of those "careful what you wish for" moments. Voters may have been taught to hate Trump and dutifully acted accordingly, but their fundamental opinion of his policies vs the Democrats have not changed.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
It's early to call that a reality, but I think must be somewhere in between the ultra-panicking and the meh-it's-nothing.Simonjester wrote: corona virus prediction....
within the next year to three years our response to this virus will be widely viewed as a global episode of mass hysteria...
there will be some who deeply committed to the panic, who will never accept that reality, but as time passes our current madness will largely become recognized for what it is...
I don't feel like I'm panicking, but I take it somewhat seriously.
Simonjester wrote: early prediction.....
not claiming the virus isn't dangerous, or demands some response, just predicting our future view of the response we are having...
Re: Coronavirus General Discussion
So in order for that to happen, someone will have to backtrack and claim they made a mistake. Who will do that: health experts, media or politicians? And keep in mind that them admitting that to the public could make it more difficult to implement authoritarian measures in future "emergencies" so it is not in their best interest to ever admit it was an overreaction, much less hysteria.Simonjester wrote: corona virus prediction....
within the next year to three years our response to this virus will be widely viewed as a global episode of mass hysteria...
there will be some who deeply committed to the panic, who will never accept that reality, but as time passes our current madness will largely become recognized for what it is...
Simonjester wrote: that is a interesting point, there may be more vested interest in the hysteria than i think...
i hope not.. but its possible...