Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
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- Kriegsspiel
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
MG, Obviously everyone can have their own opinion whether jobs/lifestyles/expectations are boring. Some dude slaving away writing code in a shoddy apartment trying to launch a platform is similar to a painter littering her shoddy apartment with canvasses trying to get into the National Gallery who is similar to an accountant practicing extreme frugality in a shoddy apartment researching the places she'll travel when she can quit. And they all think the other one is boring.
Following ERE principles allows you to do what you want way sooner than 45 years from now. Although if all you want to do is own cars and houses and stuff, you are probably fucked.
Following ERE principles allows you to do what you want way sooner than 45 years from now. Although if all you want to do is own cars and houses and stuff, you are probably fucked.
You there, Ephialtes. May you live forever.
- Pointedstick
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
There's a great quote from Mr. Really Narrow Streets that I read yesterday which encapsulates this pretty well:Kriegsspiel wrote: Following ERE principles allows you to do what you want way sooner than 45 years from now. Although if all you want to do is own cars and houses and stuff, you are probably fucked.
http://www.newworldeconomics.com/archiv ... 61613.html
Thus, the process of reducing your "needs," should begin with the process of choosing new aspirations and expectations.
I don't think you should start with the idea of "spending less." Penny-pinching. Belt-tightening. Taking the cheaper alternative. No.
For example, let's say you have an aspiration or expectation to drive an Aston Martin V12 Vantage, at $180,000.
Whoops -- not enough money.
OK, now we downgrade to a Porsche 911 Turbo, at $138,000.
Errrr ... still not enough money.
Drat. Now we downgrade still further to a lowly Nissan Skyline GT-R, at $100,000. Ugh. A Japanese car? Gimme a break.
Hmmm ... still not enough money.
OK, now we are scraping the bottom of the barrel, with the Chevrolet Camaro ZL1, at $54,000.
Not even a Corvette! A Camaro. A car for people who drink Budweiser.
This he can swing -- barely. It's a sacrifice, but it is worth it. It has a 6.2 liter V8, at 580hp, which helps make up for the Made-In-Detroit lameness of it all. If you squint, you can still see a sort of Steve McQueen manly man aura around it, although maybe only if you are over fifty.
This is the process of penny-pinching and belt-tightening. The aspiration and expectation didn't change. The person still wants to (or expects to, which is not quite the same thing) drive an Aston Martin. Now he drives a Chevy, and is depressed. He wants to upgrade, at least to the Porsche, as soon as he is able.
Plus, in the process of downgrading, a funny thing happened: he spent all his money! He spent $54,000 on a car. The reason he spent $54,000 on a car, instead of $180,000 or $100,000, is because that was all the money he had. Somehow, in the process of spending less, he spent everything. And still he is disappointed. First, he experiences "scarcity" because he doesn't have the dough to drive an Aston Martin. Then, he experiences "scarcity" because, having spent all of his money on the Chevy (estimated cost-to-own of $75,671 over five years), he has no money left, and lives in fear of the briefest interruption in his monthly paycheck. Plus, he is fat and out of shape, and spends his evenings watching movies on Netflix.
So, let's embrace a new aspiration. Let's say the person wants to play squash at a competitive level. He gets a membership at a nice squash club for $225 a quarter, and plays there six days a week, after work.
He is having a great time playing squash. He gets better and better, and rises in the rankings. Pretty soon he is the league champion. He fully attained his aspiration and expectations. He is happy and satisfied. Along the way, he also got into great shape, is in awesome health, and looks super. Plus, he met lots of other neat people, who are also squash enthusiasts. He has no time for Netflix, so he sold his television on Craigslist.
There was no penny-pinching and no belt-tightening.
By the way, he only spent $900, on annual club dues, plus $400 on equipment, for a total of $1300. He has $53,000 still in the bank, which he invests in income-producing property. This is another aspiration and expectation of his -- to acquire income-producing assets. He studies the real estate market closely, and educates himself on the details of property investment. This also takes a lot of time and effort, and is a lot of fun, and introduces him to a lot of other interesting, like-minded people, but costs almost nothing: $300 for books. So, in the process of not-belt-tightening and not-penny-pinching, he actually achieved two aspirations. Plus, the income from his property pays for his squash enthusiasms, so his net cost is zero.
He doesn't even think about what kind of car he drives. He drives a Subaru Impreza that's six years old and has 90,000 miles, which is good enough not to offend anyone. His car is largely irrelevant to him, because his attention is focused on playing squash and real estate investing. We can only focus on so many things, and if you focus on something like squash and investing, then you will naturally not focus on all the other things. He also doesn't worry about an interruption in his income. He doesn't live paycheck-to-paycheck. He is happy and satisfied with this lifestyle.
In fact, his aspirations and expectations -- playing squash and real-estate investing -- are actually much more worthwhile on an absolute basis than spending money on cars. The fact that they also don't cost much is just another plus.
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
Fantastic read, Pontedstick. Thanks for sharing.
My favorite part:
My favorite part:
I think that beautifully sums up the consumerist mindset and how so many people lose their way.Somehow, in the process of spending less, he spent everything. And still he is disappointed.
- dualstow
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
My favorite part was that a Camaro is a car for people who drink Budweiser. 
Added:
I learned early on to not spend everything. My first game of D&D was with my Dad. I had no choice- he paid for the starter kit and neither of us understood that it wasn't like settling down to a game of Parcheesi. We started out buying equipment for the journey with our gold, silver & electrum pieces. Silly young child that I was, I hastily spent everything on a horse(!) and a bow. No money left for even one quiver of arrows. My Dad then set about buying torches, flints, a dagger... I told him I wanted to forget the horse and start over. "No", he said. "You've had your turn."
I'm glad it was all just on paper, and I'm very careful in the real world.
Added:
I learned early on to not spend everything. My first game of D&D was with my Dad. I had no choice- he paid for the starter kit and neither of us understood that it wasn't like settling down to a game of Parcheesi. We started out buying equipment for the journey with our gold, silver & electrum pieces. Silly young child that I was, I hastily spent everything on a horse(!) and a bow. No money left for even one quiver of arrows. My Dad then set about buying torches, flints, a dagger... I told him I wanted to forget the horse and start over. "No", he said. "You've had your turn."
I'm glad it was all just on paper, and I'm very careful in the real world.
Last edited by dualstow on Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
Nice read indeed. Just curious about one thing: where is this analyst job that earns $400K? I kind of hope those salaries are made up, because otherwise I am getting COMPLETELY shafted.
- MachineGhost
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
That's a pretty good parable about investing vs consuming!Pointedstick wrote: We can only focus on so many things, and if you focus on something like squash and investing, then you will naturally not focus on all the other things.
But people don't obesses over productive investing like that unless they're (stereotype warning!): Asian Kids with Tiger Moms.
Since kids hardly have any free time these days as every hour is scheduled activities down to the last detail for their curriculum vitae and future college application, I wonder if there's gonna be a revolt to the other side after they gain "parental independence" or will they continue on with their "productive" in-grained behaviors?
Last edited by MachineGhost on Sat Apr 23, 2016 10:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
"All generous minds have a horror of what are commonly called 'Facts'. They are the brute beasts of the intellectual domain." -- Thomas Hobbes
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Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!
- MachineGhost
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
Didn't your Uncle earn that much? 'cuz that's where the money is!WiseOne wrote: Nice read indeed. Just curious about one thing: where is this analyst job that earns $400K? I kind of hope those salaries are made up, because otherwise I am getting COMPLETELY shafted.
"All generous minds have a horror of what are commonly called 'Facts'. They are the brute beasts of the intellectual domain." -- Thomas Hobbes
Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!
Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!
- MachineGhost
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!
Desert wrote:Yes, that is good. And typically they're drinking those Buds slightly warm, from a can ... while driving said Camaro.dualstow wrote: My favorite part was that a Camaro is a car for people who drink Budweiser.![]()

Last edited by MachineGhost on Sat Apr 23, 2016 10:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
"All generous minds have a horror of what are commonly called 'Facts'. They are the brute beasts of the intellectual domain." -- Thomas Hobbes
Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!
Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!
- MachineGhost
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Re: Sophie, you didn't tell us you had been replaced!

"All generous minds have a horror of what are commonly called 'Facts'. They are the brute beasts of the intellectual domain." -- Thomas Hobbes
Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!
Disclaimer: I am not a broker, dealer, investment advisor, physician, theologian or prophet. I should not be considered as legally permitted to render such advice!