Gyroscopic Investing

Xan wrote:

jafs wrote:when these things aren't really possible to know with any certainty.

How do you know THAT with any certainty?

You're doing exactly the same thing: assuming that your viewpoint is true, and then treating others based on your own view.

Well, I could be wrong.

But, it seems to me that by definition, faith is about things that aren't capable of being known with certainty - that's why we have that word.  In fact, one definition of faith is "firm belief in something for which there is no proof".

And, as pug says, I'm not going around trying to convert others to my view.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unfundamen ... s-to-hear/

Interesting but depressing article. Shows for a random sampling of the opinions that non-Christians have towards chrstians due to their words and actions.

Greg wrote: To extend your viewpoint more Mountaineer, this is one of the reasons why I'm interested in studying comparative religion so that ideally I will come to truth. If not, I would have such a worry that I could package a religion in a good enough way to entice someone to it and in turn, steer them away from the correct religion.

The problem is "truth" is always subjective.  Everyone is entitlted to their own version of the "truth" (but not their own objective facts).  "Truth" is metaphysical just like property, money, borders, government, etc.

Underlying your potential worry seems to be that you're intending to convert people to the one True Religion.  I think that is the single biggest bugaboo about religion in any interaction with True Believers -- there's always that dark, malevolent undercurrent of a conversion agenda that just poisons the atmosphere.

I think for your long-term peace of mind you'd be a much happier person if you worried less about what other people believe their guiding principles are so you wouldn't have need to worry.  AFAIK, being a good Christian is not dependent on converting others.  That's just missionary requirements for non-inclusive cults, i.e. Scientology, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, etc..  What's wrong with leading by example and reveling in that?

Xan wrote:

jafs wrote:when these things aren't really possible to know with any certainty.

How do you know THAT with any certainty?

You're doing exactly the same thing: assuming that your viewpoint is true, and then treating others based on your own view.

I think he's taking the scientific principle here, i.e. you can always prove things as false but never anything as true.

But we all have an OS to get by in life...  but an OS that self-propagates itself by using a worm or virus is what proselythizers are equivalent to.

MachineGhost wrote: I think he's taking the scientific principle here, i.e. you can always prove things as false but never anything as true.

In cases like this, you cannot prove them to be true OR false.
As Jafs said, it's impossible to know.

Xan wrote:

jafs wrote:when these things aren't really possible to know with any certainty.

How do you know THAT with any certainty?

You're doing exactly the same thing: assuming that your viewpoint is true, and then treating others based on your own view.

Reminds me of this quote from Mark Twain ....

"It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so."


Pretty much sums up how I feel about fundamentalist Christians religious fundamentalists.

(Modified the above sentence so it includes those who are so certain of their religious beliefs that they are willing to fly planes into buildings and blow themselves and others to kingdom come with suicide bombs).

This post is the word of God.

How do you know that it is true?

Because it says it is the word of God, and God wouldn't lie!

Now that we've established that, let's go on to the rest of the issues that need to be set right.

First, everyone has to wear their underwear on the outside so that everyone else can see if it is clean, as God commands...

curlew wrote: Reminds me of this quote from Mark Twain ....

"It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so."

According to Don Rumsfeld, it's what you don't know that you don't know. An unknown unknown.