29% of Registered Voters Believe Armed Revolution Might Be Necessary....

[murphy_p_t]

A.O....do you also deny that the redcoat plan to confiscate guns at Lexington and Concord was the direct opening cause of violent conflict in the American revolution?...a bridge too far?

Also, can you point to any corroborating articles to support your statement about gun control in the interwar period in Germany? As you know, your claim runs directly contrary to some popular slogans...

[Ad Orientem]

A.O....do you also deny that the redcoat plan to confiscate guns at Lexington and Concord was the direct opening cause of violent conflict in the American revolution?...a bridge too far?

No. It is a matter of record that the skirmishes at Lexington and Concord were the immediate spark of revolution. And for the record the British were foolish to go after the guns.

Also, can you point to any corroborating articles to support your statement about gun control in the interwar period in Germany? As you know, your claim runs directly contrary to some popular slogans...

See The Hitler gun control lie. There are quite a few related articles on the web. Even some fairly pro-gun websites seem rather embarrassed by the egregious liberties being taken with historical fact.

[Jan Van]

Way too many Americans have bought into our historical myths like the equally bizarre belief that the Pilgrims fled England to found a place where people could have freedom of religion.

You mean this?

Freedom of Religion in the Myth of the Pilgrims

The freedoms that the Puritans sought in the new world were more economic in nature than religious and, in fact, they felt that Holland had too much religious freedom. In some ways, the Pilgrim flight to the new world was a flight from religious freedom.

and
Pilgrims (Plymouth Colony)

the "children" of the group being "drawn away by evil examples into extravagance and dangerous courses"; the "great hope, for the propagating and advancing the gospell of the kingdom of Christ in those remote parts of the world

Yeah i'm Dutch...

[MachineGhost]

First, Germany had extremely restrictive gun laws under the Weimar Republic. One of the first things the Nazis did after taking power was to abolish almost all restrictions on private ownership of firearms, excepting only Jews and Communists. This remained the law until the fall of the Third Reich. And of course they did this so they could arm their private militias the SA and SS among other things.

How exactly did they "prove" if you were Jewish or a Communist?  I can understand the former by looks in the vast majority of the cases, but the latter is an invisible internal philosophy.

As a matter of historical fact, tyranny and the breakdown of democratic government is far more likely to occur in societies with few or no restrictions on private gun ownership. In such societies those with the heaviest firepower and the willingness to use it, become the de-facto law. That's why one of the hallmarks of a stable government is that the state exercises a monopoly on the use of force.

That's an interesting perspective I never considered before!  But it rings true as all the state is ever concerned about is its coercive monopoly.

[dualstow]

How exactly did they "prove" if you were Jewish or a Communist?  I can understand the former by looks in the vast majority of the cases, but the latter is an invisible internal philosophy.

As Clint Eastwood would say, prove's got nothing to do with it.

You mean this?

Freedom of Religion in the Myth of the Pilgrims

The freedoms that the Puritans sought in the new world were more economic in nature than religious and, in fact, they felt that Holland had too much religious freedom. In some ways, the Pilgrim flight to the new world was a flight from religious freedom.

Ironically, now Americans make the pilgrimage to Amsterdam for a different kind of freedom.

[AgAuMoney]

Thats true, but has totalitarianism occured in Australia, New Zealand, Canada or England yet?  I think cultural principles of democracy are far more important to stopping another Hitler than gun laws.

Don't forget that it was an attempt to impose gun laws and totalitarianism on American soil which started the shooting part of the American revolution.  It probably would have gone quite differently had the guns been taken long before they were needed in war.

Lot's of popular historical fiction here....

That's not my idea of totalitarianism. The American Revolution was a revolt orchestrated by a bunch of wealthy men who thought they shouldn't have to pay even the very modest taxes that were assessed upon them. Way too many Americans have bought into our historical myths like the equally bizarre belief that the Pilgrims fled England to found a place where people could have freedom of religion.

I'm an American. But I do understand that a lot of what I was taught in grade school was little more than propaganda. And far too often it was pure 100% unadulterated bovine excrement.

And you are dead wrong.

[AgAuMoney]

Pilgrims (Plymouth Colony)

the "children" of the group being "drawn away by evil examples into extravagance and dangerous courses"; the "great hope, for the propagating and advancing the gospell of the kingdom of Christ in those remote parts of the world

Yeah i'm Dutch...

The pilgrims did want freedom of religion.  Some left England because they did not want to belong to the church of England.  Or Irish and Catholic, etc.  Of course some left because it was either the Americas or prison and some were colonists not pilgrims at all.  But many of the original colonies were religious, founded explicitly for and with a religion, by those fleeing so they could exercise religion in the manner they wanted with those of like mind, instead of the manner followed or prescribed back home.

They just didn't want to give that freedom to anyone else and it made for quite a mess.

Specifically, that is why the U.S. constitution prohibits congress from "making any law respecting a religion."  At that time there were several (12/13 wasn't it?) states with official religions and they did not want their religions to be usurped by the new federal government.

[Ad Orientem]

Pilgrims (Plymouth Colony)

the "children" of the group being "drawn away by evil examples into extravagance and dangerous courses"; the "great hope, for the propagating and advancing the gospell of the kingdom of Christ in those remote parts of the world

Yeah i'm Dutch...

The pilgrims did want freedom of religion.  Some left England because they did not want to belong to the church of England.  Or Irish and Catholic, etc.  Of course some left because it was either the Americas or prison and some were colonists not pilgrims at all.  But many of the original colonies were religious, founded explicitly for and with a religion, by those fleeing so they could exercise religion in the manner they wanted with those of like mind, instead of the manner followed or prescribed back home.

They just didn't want to give that freedom to anyone else and it made for quite a mess.

Specifically, that is why the U.S. constitution prohibits congress from "making any law respecting a religion."  At that time there were several (12/13 wasn't it?) states with official religions and they did not want their religions to be usurped by the new federal government.

I must respectfully disagree. What you are describing (accurately) is not a desire for religious freedom. It is a desire for a theocracy. I stand by my earlier comment.

[notsheigetz]

I hesitate to post at the end of a thread with so many replies because it has almost certainly veered way off its original course. But...

I was pretty amazed at the story that said 29% of voters believe armed revolution might be necessary. Never would have suspected.

Couple that with a story on Drudge that I can no longer find that said something like 62% of college graduates think government has too much control over their lives.

If these stories be true maybe the future might not be as bleak as we think for those of us who value liberty.

[rocketdog]

I wonder what percentage believes in alien abductions?

This here 1% percenter does!!!  There's 200 billion stars in our galaxy alone for gawd's sake.

Believing in the likelihood of life on other planets is not the same thing as believing in alien abductions. 

[Kriegsspiel]

Hot damn!  I can't wait until we discover alien life.. so that we can kill all those godless heathens and take their shit!