Gyroscopic Investing

dualstow wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:39 pm Budd, you're debating someone whose screenname means "in the direction of precious metals."
Or, maybe it's a coincidence. Is your name P.M. Ward?

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:06 pm Read my history if you care to for an understanding.
My 70/30 is up 1.4 million YTD
My PP is up < 300K YTD

Why the HUGE variance?
Gold and LTT’s that’s why.
Now extrapolate this for the last 10 years and tell me why the PP is not worth the time...

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:53 pm I’ve sat through a decline in Gold on par with any market crash. I also had about 900K invested in 2008 so I think I qualify as living through a market crash.

stuper1 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:31 pm Budd,

So, yes, you are right the PP is a "coward's portfolio". I'd rather be a smart coward, than have my family be starving and shivering in the streets along with the other "brave" stock/bond investors after that solar flare hits.

Yes, that's hopefully extremely hyperbolic imagery. But the point is that having some "hard" assets to complement an electronic stock/bond portfolio won't look dumb or cowardly if something extreme happens (solar flare, nuclear war, economic meltdown, etc.).

stuper1 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:31 pm Budd,

So, yes, you are right the PP is a "coward's portfolio". I'd rather be a smart coward, than have my family be starving and shivering in the streets along with the other "brave" stock/bond investors after that solar flare hits.

Yes, that's hopefully extremely hyperbolic imagery. But the point is that having some "hard" assets to complement an electronic stock/bond portfolio won't look dumb or cowardly if something extreme happens (solar flare, nuclear war, economic meltdown, etc.).

jacksonM wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:40 pm

stuper1 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:31 pm Budd,

So, yes, you are right the PP is a "coward's portfolio". I'd rather be a smart coward, than have my family be starving and shivering in the streets along with the other "brave" stock/bond investors after that solar flare hits.

Yes, that's hopefully extremely hyperbolic imagery. But the point is that having some "hard" assets to complement an electronic stock/bond portfolio won't look dumb or cowardly if something extreme happens (solar flare, nuclear war, economic meltdown, etc.).

I had to go back a ways in this thread to find any thing like the PP being called a "coward's portfolio" and maybe I didn't go back far enough to find it or just missed it.

What half-way reasonable investor, except for maybe the very young and stupid, would give the slightest thought to such an accusation of being a "coward" in the way they manage their life savings?

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:08 pm

jacksonM wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:40 pm

stuper1 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:31 pm Budd,

So, yes, you are right the PP is a "coward's portfolio". I'd rather be a smart coward, than have my family be starving and shivering in the streets along with the other "brave" stock/bond investors after that solar flare hits.

Yes, that's hopefully extremely hyperbolic imagery. But the point is that having some "hard" assets to complement an electronic stock/bond portfolio won't look dumb or cowardly if something extreme happens (solar flare, nuclear war, economic meltdown, etc.).

I had to go back a ways in this thread to find any thing like the PP being called a "coward's portfolio" and maybe I didn't go back far enough to find it or just missed it.

What half-way reasonable investor, except for maybe the very young and stupid, would give the slightest thought to such an accusation of being a "coward" in the way they manage their life savings?

There are various “coward” portfolios around and the term is not derogatory. It implies spreading your bets across a variety of assets as to not place a bet on a single asset.

jacksonM wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:40 pm

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:08 pm

jacksonM wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:40 pm

I had to go back a ways in this thread to find any thing like the PP being called a "coward's portfolio" and maybe I didn't go back far enough to find it or just missed it.

What half-way reasonable investor, except for maybe the very young and stupid, would give the slightest thought to such an accusation of being a "coward" in the way they manage their life savings?

There are various “coward” portfolios around and the term is not derogatory. It implies spreading your bets across a variety of assets as to not place a bet on a single asset.

So, according to that definition, all of us who follow the PP are cowards. They probably need to update the definitions of economic terms to make this clear because those of us who only go by simple English still think of "coward" as a derogatory term.

In your opinion then, is this form of cowardice a good thing or a bad thing?

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:49 pm

jacksonM wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:40 pm

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:08 pm

There are various “coward” portfolios around and the term is not derogatory. It implies spreading your bets across a variety of assets as to not place a bet on a single asset.

So, according to that definition, all of us who follow the PP are cowards. They probably need to update the definitions of economic terms to make this clear because those of us who only go by simple English still think of "coward" as a derogatory term.

In your opinion then, is this form of cowardice a good thing or a bad thing?

Does it matter what I think? Do a simple Google search for coward portfolios and see for yourself. If you must know, I consider the PP the ultimate cowards portfolio as it allocates 25% to each economic condition. If an investor in the PP is also considered a coward by investing in such a portfolio then that’s you saying that and not me.

Cortopassi wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 6:20 pm The interesting thing is seeing when the scream room gets active. Been pretty quiet for a while, and late last year until early this, stocks were getting hammered. Now they’ve recovered a lot, and gold seems to have temporarily peaked. And this room gets active again!

pmward wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:25 pm The "cowards portfolio" is one specific portfolio, not a group of portfolios. It also does not resemble the PP at all. I don't think that taking a neutral stance on a portfolio is an act of cowardice. I also think that putting that implication here on a forum of people that invest this way is not great etiquette. I chose to re-allocate my portfolio in this manner because it allows me to be at peace with my investments. It allows me to get through the day without having to spend hours staring at charts and checking my balances. That's not an act of cowardice, that's allowing me to live my life and place my focus on things that matter more than my investments.

It sounds like you are not at peace with your investments. I wish that you would just sell it off, go full on 70/30, and call it a day. I mean gold and LTT's have one bad week, after performing rather well for quite some time, and it generates this much stress and emotion in you. That's not a healthy response. I think it's time to swap away from the PP and move on. Odds are you'll do just fine in the end. And you'll at least be at peace with your portfolio in the short term, and be able to quit obsessing over what gold and LTT's are doing on day to day basis. I want you to be at peace with your investments. I don't think the PP is for you. You probably swapped over at the worst possible time in decades, and it was a frustrating ride, and it's probably time to just cut the losses and move on to greener pastures. Even if things changed tomorrow and the great bear market finally came upon us and gold and LTT's came to the rescue, I still don't think you would appreciate the portfolio. I think the bad taste is stuck and there's no going back until you finally just sell it all and move on.

Libertarian666 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:34 am

pmward wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:25 pm The "cowards portfolio" is one specific portfolio, not a group of portfolios. It also does not resemble the PP at all. I don't think that taking a neutral stance on a portfolio is an act of cowardice. I also think that putting that implication here on a forum of people that invest this way is not great etiquette. I chose to re-allocate my portfolio in this manner because it allows me to be at peace with my investments. It allows me to get through the day without having to spend hours staring at charts and checking my balances. That's not an act of cowardice, that's allowing me to live my life and place my focus on things that matter more than my investments.

It sounds like you are not at peace with your investments. I wish that you would just sell it off, go full on 70/30, and call it a day. I mean gold and LTT's have one bad week, after performing rather well for quite some time, and it generates this much stress and emotion in you. That's not a healthy response. I think it's time to swap away from the PP and move on. Odds are you'll do just fine in the end. And you'll at least be at peace with your portfolio in the short term, and be able to quit obsessing over what gold and LTT's are doing on day to day basis. I want you to be at peace with your investments. I don't think the PP is for you. You probably swapped over at the worst possible time in decades, and it was a frustrating ride, and it's probably time to just cut the losses and move on to greener pastures. Even if things changed tomorrow and the great bear market finally came upon us and gold and LTT's came to the rescue, I still don't think you would appreciate the portfolio. I think the bad taste is stuck and there's no going back until you finally just sell it all and move on.

Some people just like to complain no matter how their portfolios perform.

pmward wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:25 pm The "cowards portfolio" is one specific portfolio, not a group of portfolios. It also does not resemble the PP at all. I don't think that taking a neutral stance on a portfolio is an act of cowardice. I also think that putting that implication here on a forum of people that invest this way is not great etiquette. I chose to re-allocate my portfolio in this manner because it allows me to be at peace with my investments. It allows me to get through the day without having to spend hours staring at charts and checking my balances. That's not an act of cowardice, that's allowing me to live my life and place my focus on things that matter more than my investments.

It sounds like you are not at peace with your investments. I wish that you would just sell it off, go full on 70/30, and call it a day. I mean gold and LTT's have one bad week, after performing rather well for quite some time, and it generates this much stress and emotion in you. That's not a healthy response. I think it's time to swap away from the PP and move on. Odds are you'll do just fine in the end. And you'll at least be at peace with your portfolio in the short term, and be able to quit obsessing over what gold and LTT's are doing on day to day basis. I want you to be at peace with your investments. I don't think the PP is for you. You probably swapped over at the worst possible time in decades, and it was a frustrating ride, and it's probably time to just cut the losses and move on to greener pastures. Even if things changed tomorrow and the great bear market finally came upon us and gold and LTT's came to the rescue, I still don't think you would appreciate the portfolio. I think the bad taste is stuck and there's no going back until you finally just sell it all and move on.

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:53 am

Libertarian666 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:34 am

pmward wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:25 pm The "cowards portfolio" is one specific portfolio, not a group of portfolios. It also does not resemble the PP at all. I don't think that taking a neutral stance on a portfolio is an act of cowardice. I also think that putting that implication here on a forum of people that invest this way is not great etiquette. I chose to re-allocate my portfolio in this manner because it allows me to be at peace with my investments. It allows me to get through the day without having to spend hours staring at charts and checking my balances. That's not an act of cowardice, that's allowing me to live my life and place my focus on things that matter more than my investments.

It sounds like you are not at peace with your investments. I wish that you would just sell it off, go full on 70/30, and call it a day. I mean gold and LTT's have one bad week, after performing rather well for quite some time, and it generates this much stress and emotion in you. That's not a healthy response. I think it's time to swap away from the PP and move on. Odds are you'll do just fine in the end. And you'll at least be at peace with your portfolio in the short term, and be able to quit obsessing over what gold and LTT's are doing on day to day basis. I want you to be at peace with your investments. I don't think the PP is for you. You probably swapped over at the worst possible time in decades, and it was a frustrating ride, and it's probably time to just cut the losses and move on to greener pastures. Even if things changed tomorrow and the great bear market finally came upon us and gold and LTT's came to the rescue, I still don't think you would appreciate the portfolio. I think the bad taste is stuck and there's no going back until you finally just sell it all and move on.

Some people just like to complain no matter how their portfolios perform.

Well then you should have a lot to complain about

buddtholomew wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:53 pm I’ve sat through a decline in Gold on par with any market crash. I also had about 900K invested in 2008 so I think I qualify as living through a market crash.