New Ideas about Sleep

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dualstow
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New Ideas about Sleep

Post by dualstow » Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:21 am

The conventional beliefs about sleep challenged.
Still digesting
https://guzey.com/theses-on-sleep/#comf ... -is-normal
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by snedgar » Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:19 am

I think it's intended as satire...
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by Smith1776 » Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:51 pm

It looks like something Cosmo Kramer wrote. O0
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by dualstow » Tue Jan 24, 2023 6:42 pm

snedgar wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:19 am
I think it's intended as satire...
One might think so if it were short, but it goes on and on. You can see comments beneath, with the author’s responses.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by dualstow » Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:42 pm

Let 2023 be the year of LASAGNE
AP African American Studies course rejected by Florida to be revised, College Board says
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by whatchamacallit » Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:11 pm

As a lifelong insomniac I can get on board with the body wanting to stay awake for 30 to 40 hours.

If I didn't have to live by a schedule I could see getting into a sleep schedule that did not revolve around a time of day at all.

I can't even comprehend being able to sleep for 10 hours and feel pretty lucky if I get a solid 6.

Seems like I remember reading or hearing that Harry Browne himself kept some odd sleeping habits staying up until morning.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am

This is a great find dualstow, thanks. I LOL'd at this part, "Lack of sleep is such a potent trigger for mania that acute sleep deprivation is literally used to treat depression." I've been experimenting with something like this for a few months now, bouncing between <6 hours and 7.5-9, after noticing that a little bit of sleep dep was actually making me feel pretty good.

There was an AOM podcast on sleep last year where the guy basically says to forget about setting bedtimes, just wake up at the same time every day. So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.
One other argument for sleeping the “natural” (7-9) number of hours is that we feel bad on days when we sleep less. In this section, I argue against this line of reasoning by asking: if fasting and exercising are good, shouldn’t acute sleep deprivation also be good? And I conclude that it is probably good.
I think he's right on. Long periods of sleep dep are painful, but periodically it's like a nice reset. Jocko has talked about mild sleep dep not being a big deal either, and he's on point about pretty much everything. I suspect he's one of the DEC2/ADRB1/NPSR1 genetically-gifted, but for the rest of us it's still not the end of the world.

Good stuff.
And as for him who lacks the courage to defend even his own soul: Let him not brag of his progressive views, boast of his status as an academician or a recognized artist, a distinguished citizen or general. Let him say to himself plainly: I am cattle, I am a coward, I seek only warmth and to eat my fill.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:35 am

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am
There was an AOM podcast on sleep last year where the guy basically says to forget about setting bedtimes, just wake up at the same time every day. So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.
I just noticed he mentions this in his notes at the bottom of the article. His observations on the boringness of the environment there are spot on as well.
And as for him who lacks the courage to defend even his own soul: Let him not brag of his progressive views, boast of his status as an academician or a recognized artist, a distinguished citizen or general. Let him say to himself plainly: I am cattle, I am a coward, I seek only warmth and to eat my fill.
Solzhenitsyn, Live Not By Lies
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by dualstow » Wed Jan 25, 2023 8:24 am

Jocko is the Art of Manliness guy?
I wonder if he derived his name from Devo’s ‘Jocko Homo’ (“Are we not men?”)
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am

So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.
Sounds kind of like intermittent fasting for sleep.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by Mark Leavy » Wed Jan 25, 2023 9:14 am

dualstow wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 8:24 am
Jocko is the Art of Manliness guy?
No, he's the ex Navy Seal guy. Interesting dude.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by dualstow » Wed Jan 25, 2023 9:19 am

Ahhhhh. Many thanks 🙏
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by DogBreath » Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:21 am

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am
There was an AOM podcast on sleep last year where the guy basically says to forget about setting bedtimes, just wake up at the same time every day. So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.
Once you get past about 55yo you can't sleep to when you want, or stay up 'til whenever for that matter. At least for me, I feel like absolute crap all day if I get less than 6.5 hours sleep, so doing that intentionally is not going to happen.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by vnatale » Wed Jan 25, 2023 12:49 pm

DogBreath wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:21 am

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am

There was an AOM podcast on sleep last year where the guy basically says to forget about setting bedtimes, just wake up at the same time every day. So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.



Once you get past about 55yo you can't sleep to when you want, or stay up 'til whenever for that matter. At least for me, I feel like absolute crap all day if I get less than 6.5 hours sleep, so doing that intentionally is not going to happen.


I would have thought for you with all your physical activity (pickle ball +) that you'd have better sleep than the typical person your age.

If I regulate my liquid intake at night so as to not be woken up to get rid of it I can go 6, 7 hours without waking up. Also, last month I was so intent to finally get a certain phase done of something I'd been working on that I stayed up until 6 AM (which I think meant I'd been awake for about 24 hours).

Before I got back into my exercise program this month I was having some nights where I'd wake up and could not get back to sleep which left me going all day on only a few hours sleep. I was always surprised when at night I'd be feeling great and then remember that I had been going on only a few hours sleep that day.
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by DogBreath » Wed Jan 25, 2023 2:15 pm

vnatale wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 12:49 pm
DogBreath wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:21 am
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am
There was an AOM podcast on sleep last year where the guy basically says to forget about setting bedtimes, just wake up at the same time every day. So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.
Once you get past about 55yo you can't sleep to when you want, or stay up 'til whenever for that matter. At least for me, I feel like absolute crap all day if I get less than 6.5 hours sleep, so doing that intentionally is not going to happen.
I would have thought for you with all your physical activity (pickle ball +) that you'd have better sleep than the typical person your age.

If I regulate my liquid intake at night so as to not be woken up to get rid of it I can go 6, 7 hours without waking up. Also, last month I was so intent to finally get a certain phase done of something I'd been working on that I stayed up until 6 AM (which I think meant I'd been awake for about 24 hours).

Before I got back into my exercise program this month I was having some nights where I'd wake up and could not get back to sleep which left me going all day on only a few hours sleep. I was always surprised when at night I'd be feeling great and then remember that I had been going on only a few hours sleep that day.
Ya, you would think. I often get 5 hours of strenuous exercise in, but I still sleep like crap. I don't wake up to pee, I wake up and just can't fall back to sleep. It sucks.
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by Mountaineer » Wed Jan 25, 2023 3:01 pm

DogBreath wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:21 am
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:31 am
There was an AOM podcast on sleep last year where the guy basically says to forget about setting bedtimes, just wake up at the same time every day. So what I've been doing is setting an alarm every day, and if I'm not asleep in time to get 7.5+, I'll stay awake long enough to make it a <6 hour sleep.
Once you get past about 55yo you can't sleep to when you want, or stay up 'til whenever for that matter. At least for me, I feel like absolute crap all day if I get less than 6.5 hours sleep, so doing that intentionally is not going to happen.
+1 for the Pugster
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Re: New Ideas about Sleep

Post by dualstow » Wed Jan 25, 2023 3:53 pm

DogBreath wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:21 am
Once you get past about 55yo you can't sleep to when you want, or stay up 'til whenever for that matter. At least for me, I feel like absolute crap all day if I get less than 6.5 hours sleep, so doing that intentionally is not going to happen.
I’m not quite there yet in age but I noticed my sleep is like that. Lucky to get 6 hours in a night unless it’s catchup sleep for the week. Blissful, sweet catchup sleep, when the cat decides to give me a break and eat breakfast late.
Let 2023 be the year of LASAGNE
AP African American Studies course rejected by Florida to be revised, College Board says
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