Coronavirus General Discussion

[Maddy]

One of the hallmarks of totalitarianism is mass conformity to a psychotic official narrative. Not a regular official narrative, like the “Cold War” or the “War on Terror” narratives. A totally delusional official narrative that has little or no connection to reality and that is contradicted by a preponderance of facts.
* * *
These narratives are invariably paranoid, portraying the cult as threatened or persecuted by an evil enemy or antagonistic force which only unquestioning conformity to the cult’s ideology can save its members from. It makes little difference whether this antagonist is mainstream culture, body thetans, counter-revolutionaries, Jews, or a virus.

The point is not the identity of the enemy. The point is the atmosphere of paranoia and hysteria the official narrative generates, which keeps the cult members (or the society) compliant.

In addition to being paranoid, these narratives are often internally inconsistent, illogical, and … well, just completely ridiculous. This does not weaken them, as one might suspect. Actually, it increases their power, as it forces their adherents to attempt to reconcile their inconsistency and irrationality, and in many cases utter absurdity, in order to remain in good standing with the cult.

Such reconciliation is of course impossible, and causes the cult members’ minds to short circuit and abandon any semblance of critical thinking, which is precisely what the cult leader wants.

Moreover, cult leaders will often radically change these narratives for no apparent reason, forcing their cult members to abruptly forswear (and often even denounce as “heresy”) the beliefs they had previously been forced to profess, and behave as if they had never believed them, which causes their minds to further short circuit, until they eventually give up even trying to think rationally, and just mindlessly parrot whatever nonsensical gibberish the cult leader fills their heads with.

Also, the cult leader’s nonsensical gibberish is not as nonsensical as it may seem at first. Most of us, upon encountering such gibberish, assume that the cult leader is trying to communicate, and that something is very wrong with his brain. The cult leader isn’t trying to communicate. He is trying to disorient and control the listener’s mind.
* * *
It is happening to most of our societies right now. An official narrative is being implemented. A totalitarian official narrative. A totally psychotic official narrative, no less delusional than that of the Nazis, or the Manson family, or any other cult.
* * *
When reality falls apart completely, the mind will create a delusional narrative, which appears just as “real” as our normal reality, because even a delusion is better than the stark raving terror of utter chaos.

This is what totalitarians and cult leaders count on, and exploit to implant their narratives in our minds, and why actual initiation rituals (as opposed to purely symbolic rituals) begin by attacking the subject’s mind with terror, pain, physical exhaustion, psychedelic drugs, or some other means of obliterating the subject’s perception of reality.

Once that is achieved, and the subject’s mind starts desperately trying to construct a new narrative to make sense out of the cognitive chaos and psychological trauma it is undergoing, it is relatively easy to “guide” that process and implant whatever narrative you want. . .
* * *
Their initiation into the Covidian Cult began in January, when the medical authorities and corporate media turned on The Fear with projections of hundreds of millions of deaths and fake photos of people dropping dead in the streets. The psychological conditioning has continued for months.

The global masses have been subjected to a constant stream of propaganda, manufactured hysteria, wild speculation, conflicting directives, exaggerations, lies, and tawdry theatrical effects. Lockdowns. Emergency field hospitals and morgues. The singing-dancing NHS staff. Death trucks. Overflowing ICUs. Dead Covid babies. Manipulated statistics. Goon squads. Masks. And all the rest of it.

Eight months later, here we are. The Head of the Health Emergencies Program at the WHO has basically confirmed an IFR of 0.14%, approximately the same as the seasonal flu.
* * *
The “science” argument is officially over. An increasing number of doctors and medical experts are breaking ranks and explaining how the current mass hysteria over “cases” (which now includes perfectly healthy people) is essentially meaningless propaganda. . .
* * *
Which does not matter in the least, not to the members of the Covidian Cult. Facts do not matter to totalitarians and cult members. What matters is loyalty to the cult or the party.

Which means we have a serious problem, those of us to whom facts still matter, and who have been trying to use them to convince the Covidian cultists that they are wrong about the virus … for going on eight months at this point.
* * *
What we are up against is not a misunderstanding or a rational argument over scientific facts. It is a fanatical ideological movement. A global totalitarian movement … the first of its kind in human history.

https://off-guardian.org/2020/10/13/the-covidian-cult/

[Cortopassi]

Chris Christie statement after his time in the ICU:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/15/politics ... index.html

Most important part, for me, my highlight:

I have also concluded that like much else in 2020, that the virus is governed by our two dominant
political and media extremes: those who believe there is nothing to this virus and those
alarmists who would continue to close down our country and not trust the common sense
of the American people. Both are wrong. This is not an either/or proposition. The public
health consequences of ignoring the virus and the responsible safeguards that we need to
take will be additional illness and death caused by COVID-19. The public policy
consequences of continuing to shut down or re-shut down our country will be further
economic devastation to families, even more loss of education by our students and the
continuing loss of life through the drug abuse, suicide and depression caused by taking
away people’s ability to support their families. There is another way.

[I Shrugged]

As Gov Cuomo and his extensive PR team attempt to “reimagine” his response to COVID-19, here’s a Twitter thread to remind everyone what an epic fail it really was.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1316 ... 96448.html

I went down this road with a friend who blames Trump for the early days of bad information. What see the Woodward book. So how does the March timeline of Cuomo's statements compare with information that was known or suspected by DC, and when was said info communicated to the states?

ie Did Cuomo know the situation yet, in early and mid March?

[Tortoise]

Chris Christie statement after his time in the ICU:
[...]

Christie goes on in his statement to describe his recommended approach (boldface mine):

Every public official, regardless of party or position, should advocate for every American to wear a mask in public, appropriately socially distance and to wash your hands frequently every day. At the same time, we should be reopening in every corner of this nation under these guidelines. Reopen all those places which have taken the brunt of these shutdowns and allow our country to get back to a life where citizens can support their families using common sense. Even during a contentious election year, we must trust the American people with the truth. I believe that these two steps can bring our country together while our pharmaceutical companies invent the therapeutics and vaccines which will rid us of this virus.

The problem with recommending that all Americans socially distance is that it's not viable long-term for many businesses like restaurants, movie theaters, and performance venues. If those businesses are allowed to operate only at 25-50% capacity to meet social distancing requirements, they will bleed red ink until they eventually go out of business. Many of them already have, even though they've "reopened". Christie doesn't acknowledge that in his letter.

Christie missed a good opportunity to point out that Covid-1984 doesn't pose the same risk to all Americans. It poses near-zero risk to most of the population and a much higher risk to the morbidly obese like Christie and to the very old.

It's really sad that "Let businesses reopen at full capacity while protecting the very old and the morbidly obese" is widely seen as an extreme position for some reason.

[doodle]

Chris Christie statement after his time in the ICU:
[...]

Christie goes on in his statement to describe his recommended approach (boldface mine):

Every public official, regardless of party or position, should advocate for every American to wear a mask in public, appropriately socially distance and to wash your hands frequently every day. At the same time, we should be reopening in every corner of this nation under these guidelines. Reopen all those places which have taken the brunt of these shutdowns and allow our country to get back to a life where citizens can support their families using common sense. Even during a contentious election year, we must trust the American people with the truth. I believe that these two steps can bring our country together while our pharmaceutical companies invent the therapeutics and vaccines which will rid us of this virus.

The problem with recommending that all Americans socially distance is that it's not viable long-term for many businesses like restaurants, movie theaters, and performance venues. If those businesses are allowed to operate only at 25-50% capacity to meet social distancing requirements, they will bleed red ink until they eventually go out of business. Many of them already have, even though they've "reopened". Christie doesn't acknowledge that in his letter.

Christie missed a good opportunity to point out that Covid-1984 doesn't pose the same risk to all Americans. It poses near-zero risk to most of the population and a much higher risk to the morbidly obese like Christie and to the very old.

It's really sad that "Let businesses reopen at full capacity while protecting the very old and the morbidly obese" is widely seen as an extreme position for some reason.

I think that is probably the most rational position at this time....at least it is worth a try...there will be casualties for sure. Children and young people will get sick and die. This will complicate the situation..but as has been mentioned before kids die in car accidents too and we don't stop driving... I think that if our politicians behaved like adults and we had a leader who was better at communicating in the white house that might actually be very possible. Unfortunately none of those are true...humans suck.

[I Shrugged]

The death rate doesn't seem to be much worse than a bad flu though.
ALTHOUGH, if the PCR tests are indeed putting out a lot of positives that are functional false, then that would make the death rate look lower.

[doodle]

New Zealand yesterday. No masks or social distancing required.

rmafmk9d2gs51.png (708.02 KiB) Viewed 5296 times

That could be because their nation seems to be largely free from this breed of animal that dominates the American landscape

https://youtu.be/5ukzFwBPwd4

[Mark Leavy]

New Zealand yesterday. No masks or social distancing required.
That could be because their nation seems to be largely free from this breed of animal that dominates the American landscape

Or because they have the most fierce border closure on the planet.

The New Zealand border is currently closed to almost all travellers to help stop the spread of COVID-19.

[doodle]

The fact is that they are attending crowded sporting events without masks while our numbers are continuing to increase in what is now being called a third wave while we lose nearly 1000 lives a day. The prime minister uses american education as a punchline and people laugh.

Donald Trump failed to lead this nation through this pandemic. Anyone in the business world doing this job as poorly as he did would have been fired.

[pp4me]

Donald Trump failed to lead this nation through this pandemic.

If you don't give any specifics that sounds like nothing more than the Democrat talking point we keep hearing over and over. It works because there is nothing to challenge. If you say he did X when he should have done Y then that can either be debated or else we can agree with you.

[yankees60]

New Zealand yesterday. No masks or social distancing required.

rmafmk9d2gs51.png



That could be because their nation seems to be largely free from this breed of animal that dominates the American landscape

https://youtu.be/5ukzFwBPwd4

There were some fans in the stands at last night's Dodgers / Braves game.

This picture is from the first game of their series.

Capture.JPG (174.96 KiB) Viewed 5336 times

Vinny

[WiseOne]

Has anyone considered the possibility that *nothing* that any governing body has done has either promoted or prevented the spread of the virus?

In other words, the spread of the virus is not anyone's fault. It's not Trump's fault, it's not Cuomo's fault, and so on. It's about the biology of epidemics. Trying to negate that biology is sort of like the kid who tries to empty the ocean into a sand pit on the beach using a little plastic bucket.

I remember that during the height of the AIDS epidemic, people who blamed the victims for their promiscuous/risky behavior, or said it was a judgment from God, were roundly condemned. I wish we had a bit of that sentiment today.

[I Shrugged]

Has anyone considered the possibility that *nothing* that any governing body has done has either promoted or prevented the spread of the virus?

In other words, the spread of the virus is not anyone's fault....

I have. That’s how it looks to me.

[yankees60]

Has anyone considered the possibility that *nothing* that any governing body has done has either promoted or prevented the spread of the virus?

In other words, the spread of the virus is not anyone's fault. It's not Trump's fault, it's not Cuomo's fault, and so on. It's about the biology of epidemics. Trying to negate that biology is sort of like the kid who tries to empty the ocean into a sand pit on the beach using a little plastic bucket.

I remember that during the height of the AIDS epidemic, people who blamed the victims for their promiscuous/risky behavior, or said it was a judgment from God, were roundly condemned. I wish we had a bit of that sentiment today.

Is what you say somewhat analogous to saying that humans have had no effect on climate change? That we are just witnessing the natural course of climate change?

Vinny

[yankees60]

Why Your Hand Sanitizer May Be Ineffective Or Tainted By Cancer-Causing Chemicals


https://www.forbes.com/sites/ericmack/2 ... 15ec2b6241

[flyingpylon]

Has anyone considered the possibility that *nothing* that any governing body has done has either promoted or prevented the spread of the virus?

In other words, the spread of the virus is not anyone's fault. It's not Trump's fault, it's not Cuomo's fault, and so on. It's about the biology of epidemics. Trying to negate that biology is sort of like the kid who tries to empty the ocean into a sand pit on the beach using a little plastic bucket.

I remember that during the height of the AIDS epidemic, people who blamed the victims for their promiscuous/risky behavior, or said it was a judgment from God, were roundly condemned. I wish we had a bit of that sentiment today.

What IS Cuomo's fault is sending covid-positive patients into nursing homes.
That resulted in quite a few premature deaths.

It’s also Cuomo’s fault for attempting to take a victory lap with his new book.

[Hal]

Woo Hoo!

Latest news from "The Peoples Paradise"!
I can now get my hair cut after four months and travel up to 25 Km from home before I get my head kicked in

https://www.theage.com.au/national/vict ... 5665n.html

And Automatic car washes will be allowed; such freedom

PS: At least some people have a sense of humour, they have been busy at Uncyclopedia!
https://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/Victoria_Police

[Kriegsspiel]

HAH

[yankees60]

EXPLAINER
How Long Does Coronavirus Last on Surfaces?
The coronavirus responsible for the disease COVID-19 can remain intact on surfaces for anywhere up to 72 hours, according to a study conducted by US researchers.
The precise figure depends heavily on the type of surface infected droplets land on, and might also rely on the density of virus particles in the spray, and other environmental conditions - such as temperature and sunlight.
But with so many particles found to still be infectious after being in the air for a number of hours, the evidence shows why we need to be so concerned with simple hygiene.
Scientists from the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, the Centers for Disease Control, Princeton University, and University of California, Los Angeles, experimented with the SARS-CoV-2 virus under laboratory conditions to determine how fast virus particles broke down outside of a host body.
Previous research examining the literature on animal and human strains of coronavirus provided insight into the virus's ability to keep its integrity as it moves through the environment. But until now, experimental evidence on new SARS-CoV-2 has been limited.
The virus behind the 2003 SARS epidemic, SARS-CoV-1, was also tested for comparison, with strains of both pathogens sprayed as micrometre-sized droplets onto various surfaces including cardboard, copper, and plastic.
Just hanging about in the atmosphere, the effect of factors such as UV light and heat causes the mix of RNA, fatty membrane, and protein making up the particles to steadily break down in a few hours.
Dropped onto plastic, the two virus strains appear to be able to stay intact far longer. Only half of the SARS-CoV-2 particles broke apart in just under seven hours, for example, with viable coronavirus particles still detected up to three days later.
Stainless steel was almost as bad, with a half-life for SARS-CoV-2 of 5.6 hours.
Copper, on the other hand, failed to provide similar protection for either strain, with the number of viable particles capable of causing disease vanishing within just four hours for SARS-CoV-2, and eight hours for SARS-CoV-1.
Similarly, on cardboard, no viable SARS-CoV-2 particles could be found after 24 hours, or SARS-CoV-1 after eight.
There are still a number of variables to keep in mind. Variations in individual results show how much the timing is affected by subtle differences.
The laboratory was also kept at a fairly consistent 21 to 23 degrees Celsius, and 65 percent humidity. Just how this latest virus behaves in other conditions of lighting, humidity, and temperature is left to be seen.
What does this mean for the COVID-19 pandemic?
While the figures weren't identical for each of the strains, they were similar enough to raise questions over why the two epidemics have spread in such dramatically different ways.
In 2003, SARS-CoV-1 spread out of China through 26 countries, causing more than 8,000 known infections. The 2020 SARS-CoV-2 pandemic has far exceeded the rate and reach of the previous coronavirus infection, leading researchers to investigate reasons for the difference.
With differences in their ability to remain viable in the environment ruled out, other possibilities need to be considered, including the likelihood of infected individuals failing to experience symptoms in the same way.
On a more practical front, the study reaffirms the need to disinfect surfaces – especially those made of plastic and stainless steel – where possible. In addition, after touching any of these surfaces, it's important to wash your hands with soap and water.
This research was published in The New England Journal of Medicine.
All articles are determined by fact checkers to be correct and relevant at the time of publishing. Information published on the coronavirus during the 2020 COVID-19 pandemic may be updated frequently to reflect the dynamic nature of current understanding.

[I Shrugged]

Woo Hoo!

Latest news from "The Peoples Paradise"!
I can now get my hair cut after four months and travel up to 25 Km from home before I get my head kicked in

https://www.theage.com.au/national/vict ... 5665n.html

And Automatic car washes will be allowed; such freedom

Jesus that's some crazy level of detail. It probably took them 100 days to concoct it.
So with all the prior restrictions, did covid drop to nil?

[Hal]

Jesus that's some crazy level of detail. It probably took them 100 days to concoct it.
So with all the prior restrictions, did covid drop to nil?

No, still having infections. Guess the virus isn't following the regulations

For crazy, how's this.
1. Want to cut grass at my mothers house in the country
2. Phone regional council.
3. They send out inspector to check height of grass.
4. They send grass cutting permit
5. Have to present it to police at "Ring of Steel"
(seriously, I spoke to a council officer whose job it is to check "grass height" )

https://twitter.com/aussieval10/status/ ... 3078300672

[I Shrugged]

Jesus that's some crazy level of detail. It probably took them 100 days to concoct it.
So with all the prior restrictions, did covid drop to nil?

No, still having infections. Guess the virus isn't following the regulations

For crazy, how's this.
1. Want to cut grass at my mothers house in the country
2. Phone regional council.
3. They send out inspector to check height of grass.
4. They send grass cutting permit
5. Have to present it to police at "Ring of Steel"
(seriously, I spoke to a council officer whose job it is to check "grass height" )

https://twitter.com/aussieval10/status/ ... 3078300672

Insanity. Are any citizens thinking about moving? Will the current leaders be re-elected?

[yankees60]

Vinny, if you're going to post stuff like that, please provide a link to the source.

I had thought that this covered it? "This research was published in The New England Journal of Medicine."

I put here what I'd received in an email.

Vinny

[yankees60]

Vinny, if you're going to post stuff like that, please provide a link to the source.

I had thought that this covered it? "This research was published in The New England Journal of Medicine."

I put here what I'd received in an email.

Vinny

And, if anyone was more interested in the source than that then someone could have easily pasted one of its sentences into Bing (like I just did) and got this back in return: https://www.sciencealert.com/how-long-d ... n-surfaces

Vinny

[Hal]

Jesus that's some crazy level of detail. It probably took them 100 days to concoct it.
So with all the prior restrictions, did covid drop to nil?

No, still having infections. Guess the virus isn't following the regulations

For crazy, how's this.
1. Want to cut grass at my mothers house in the country
2. Phone regional council.
3. They send out inspector to check height of grass.
4. They send grass cutting permit
5. Have to present it to police at "Ring of Steel"
(seriously, I spoke to a council officer whose job it is to check "grass height" )

https://twitter.com/aussieval10/status/ ... 3078300672

Insanity. Are any citizens thinking about moving? Will the current leaders be re-elected?

Answer at the 14:20 minute mark
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuGKjtpw4QA