Trump as tragicomedy

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vnatale
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:45 am

stuper1 wrote:
Sat Jan 26, 2019 2:53 pm
Continuing in that vein, and since this thread is about Trump, I read in someone's post above that Trump is hateful.

Could someone please list one or more actions that Trump has taken as president that demonstrate his hatefulness?

I realize that words can be considered as actions, especially if they are meant to incite action by someone else. But for the purposes of this exercise, I would prefer examples that are not just words but are actual action-actions (mainly because I don't trust that the words as reported to the public by the media have not been twisted).
You can judge for yourself by:

1) Going to his Twitter account and reading what he has tweeted. I've heard that he has become quite the prolific tweeter in recent days.

2) Go here and watch as many of his rallies as you'd like. I've seen many of them. Sometimes repeatedly.

https://www.c-span.org/search/?searchty ... rump+rally

Nothing anyone says here (or, probably anyone else) will convince you he demonstrates hatefulness.

Only you can decide that for yourself. If nothing in 1) or 2) convinces you then, in your worldview, he does NOT demonstrate hatefulness. 1) and 2) go right to the source and cut out anything from that DEMON known as the Mainstream Media.

Vinny

Vinny
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:50 am

Cortopassi wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:43 pm
When he did his sing song of this:

"We will have a national emergency, and we will then be sued, and they will sue us in the 9th Circuit, even though it shouldn't be there, and we will possibly get a bad ruling, and then we'll get another bad ruling, and then we'll end up in the Supreme Court, and hopefully we'll get a fair shake and we'll win in the Supreme Court."

I thought: God damn. The president of the United States is up there like a valley girl.

He is so contradictory in virtually every sentence he utters it is mind boggling.

"No, no, I use many stats. I use many stats."

Pretty sure he would never make it as an engineer or any kind of analyst.

Back to my questions a few days ago of:

1) You'd like your daughter to marry him
2) You'd like to be his coworker (NOT him being your boss)
3) You'd hire him to be the president of which you are 100% owner

And, I fully believe that running this country HAS to be the most complicated / complex job of any other job in the country.

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:53 am

stuper1 wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 12:04 pm
boglerdude wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 12:26 am
"Meanwhile American culture continues to disappear. Big business wants the money and couldn't care less about culture."

As a stockholder you are big business. And what is "culture." We want immigrants who will increase GDP and not drain it, maybe instead of a border wall it should be an obstacle course
What is culture? I googled it. It says culture is the customs, arts, social institutions, and achievements of a particular nation, people, or other social group. Are you saying that you don't believe that is actually a real thing? Do you enjoy traveling? When you go to China is it the same as going to Zimbabwe? Is that a good thing or a bad thing? Personally, I think it's a good thing. It makes traveling more enjoyable.

Believe it or not, America has a culture too. Big business is ruining our culture by encouraging immigration at rates that are too high to allow the immigrants to assimilate to our culture. Instead they tend to stay in their own groups and keep too much of their own culture. Is that a good thing? I say no. If they want to keep their own culture, why don't they stay in their own country and improve it from within? But it's really not the immigrants' fault. You can't blame them for wanting to better their own standard of living. It's the fault of the powers in this country for allowing too much legal and illegal immigration.

I have no idea whether you were born in this country or how old you are. I was born in the mid-1960s. I can certainly say that the America I live in today is quite different from the one I grew up in. I don't think the changes are for the better.

After tonight reading all you've written I'm surprised to find out that you are 10-15 years YOUNGER than me!

VInny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:54 am

boglerdude wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:18 pm
> I have no idea whether you were born in this country or how old you are. I was born in the mid-1960s. I can certainly say that the America I live in today is quite different from the one I grew up in. I don't think the changes are for the better.

You're about 10 years older than me. Describe what you've personally seen and how it compares to the mass media narratives =)
And, that then makes you 20-25 years YOUNGER than me. Yet we seem to share somewhat similar worldviews.

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by boglerdude » Mon Jan 27, 2020 5:13 am

Vinny lets talk about your ADHD?
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by pugchief » Mon Jan 27, 2020 8:06 am

vnatale wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 11:49 pm
pugchief wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:50 am
There is currently a lawsuit by the Attorneys General of 12(?) states to eliminate the pre-existing conditions clause of the ACA. Personally, while I think the ACA was a big, expensive lie and added thousands of needless regulations to healthcare, the elimination of pre-existing conditions was the one good thing to come out of it. But there is no doubt that this drives up the cost for everyone else. Socialism at its finest, and I hate Socialism, but it was a necessary evil.
I don't think you truly hate Socialism; you hate the current level of Socialism. Otherwise, if we were to eliminate ALL socialism wouldn't we have to get rid of all the following?

1) Police departments
2) Public schools
3) Departments of Public Works
4) Fire Departments
5) The Military

Am I missing any big ones?

To truly do without socialism doesn't that mean that each and every one of us would have to do it on our own? Protect ourselves both locally and from other nations? Teach our own children? Build our own highways (somehow!). Put out our own fires? And, on and on and on.

I think you'd agree that SOME socialism IS necessary. The disagreement comes as to what degree is necessary.

Vinny
That is not Socialism. The government provides these things via are tax dollars. Yes, they could be theoretically privatized, but there is no redistribution of wealth involved.

Government run health care OTOH, is socialistic in the sense that healthy people heavily subsidize the sick. You take good care of yourself (exercise, eat healthy, don't do drugs or smoke cigs, etc) and you still pay for the irresponsible. You saved and paid off your college loans, socialism will forgive the irresponsible gender studies major who racked up $200,000 in debt for a worthless, unemployable degree. Check out yesterday's viral video where a man calls out Warren on her loan forgiveness plan. It's priceless.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by Cortopassi » Mon Jan 27, 2020 8:50 am

vnatale wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:50 am
Cortopassi wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:43 pm
When he did his sing song of this:

"We will have a national emergency, and we will then be sued, and they will sue us in the 9th Circuit, even though it shouldn't be there, and we will possibly get a bad ruling, and then we'll get another bad ruling, and then we'll end up in the Supreme Court, and hopefully we'll get a fair shake and we'll win in the Supreme Court."

I thought: God damn. The president of the United States is up there like a valley girl.

He is so contradictory in virtually every sentence he utters it is mind boggling.

"No, no, I use many stats. I use many stats."

Pretty sure he would never make it as an engineer or any kind of analyst.

Back to my questions a few days ago of:

1) You'd like your daughter to marry him
2) You'd like to be his coworker (NOT him being your boss)
3) You'd hire him to be the president of which you are 100% owner

And, I fully believe that running this country HAS to be the most complicated / complex job of any other job in the country.

Vinny
Vinny, you are on fire! When I first joined this group I had thought about putting together a book of the best threads. But I immediately found that way too daunting.

You should do it. You've got the energy for it!

And for your questions, 1: Hell no. 2: Hell no. 3: I can see how this could be enticing because he is a win at any cost guy, but hell no.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by Cortopassi » Mon Jan 27, 2020 8:53 am

vnatale wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:00 am
Cortopassi wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 9:49 am
flyingpylon wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 9:39 am
Cortopassi wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:16 am
I read Bob Woodward's book Fear, and assuming his sources and details are accurate...
It might be worth reading some critical reviews of Fear and Woodward's other books for additional input, if you haven't already.
I will. And I assume it will dispute a lot of the accounts. The problem is, you can easily imagine that's the state of the White House given how he acts in public and on Twitter.

On the way Trump operates -- I have had 13 different jobs in almost 30 years of working. I have worked at companies where the owner/CEO/manager was a tyrant, a bigot, a narcissist, a back stabber, and a few where they were genuinely good people and motivators. Sure you can lead with a stick, but I have always performed my best when I had respect for my manager and/or the CEO vs. hating/fearing them.

13 jobs in 30 years!!! Were several of those jobs with some of the same companies? Or, also 13 different employers?!!

In the last 41 years I've been employed I've only had five employers (one of them was for only one year with all the others being fairly long-termed).

VInny
It is impossible to keep up with you and these embedded questions!

13 different employers. All job changes except one were due to layoffs, downsizing, outsourcing. Why I've cautioned both my daughters not to be engineers.

Although I am coming up on 14 years at the same place, with a great environment and a CEO who was an engineer, knows his stuff, and knows how the process works.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Mon Jan 27, 2020 9:53 am

boglerdude wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 5:13 am
Vinny lets talk about your ADHD?
I'm just about the complete opposite to this...


https://www.vyvanse.com/adhd-adult-symp ... &gclsrc=ds

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by technovelist » Mon Jan 27, 2020 10:02 am

vnatale wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:05 pm
jhogue wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:19 am
Pointedstick,

Is Trump really the “de facto leader of conservative America”?

See Peggy Noonan’s column in last Saturday’s WSJ. Ronald Reagan’s most loyal speechwriter described Trump as “Woody Allen without the Humor.” She also scorched him for being a disgrace to American masculinity and unseemly in his remarks to the Boy Scouts. Can’t imagine her insisting (ala Reagan) that we just “Let Trump Be Trump!”

One possibility is that Trump will end up splitting the Republicans the way Teddy Roosevelt split the GOP between progressives and conservatives. The other is that this faux populist will fade into irrelevance and obscurity, like Jesse Ventura, the former pro wrestler who became governor of Minnesota in a 3-way contest against an unusually weak Democrat and an unappealing Republican.
I used to regularly hear Peggy Noonan on one of the Sunday news shows. During those shows she NEVER had ANTYING good to say about anyone who was a Democrat. So, was I shocked when I saw her as a regular this past Friday morning on MSNBC discussing the Impeachment Trial. NEVER thought I'd see Peggy Noonan rejecting anything Republican!

Vinny
Peggy Noonan is a neocon who has stage 4 TDS.
I.e., if Stalin were the D candidate she would support him over Trump.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by technovelist » Mon Jan 27, 2020 10:03 am

vnatale wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:29 pm
technovelist wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:40 pm
l82start wrote:
Maddy wrote:
technovelist wrote:
That's just the surface. Underneath they are frightened that he is going to dismantle the deep state.
I agree. If you go back through the last half-century of history, a clear pattern emerges. In one form or another, some boogy-man gets trotted out on cue (N Korea) with the purpose of distracting the masses and of instilling such fear, uncertainty, and/or disdain for the manufactured enemy that the people will line up in support of whatever course of action the oligarchy is proposing to protect them--whether it be war, martial law, bank bail-outs, or something else.
the trump hawkishness toward N Korea gives me reason to doubt the MIC deep state is really worried about trump. the regulatory deep state and the political establishment corruption/pervert deep state seem to have more to worry about... and thats a good thing even if it doesn't strike at the heart of this countries deep state problems..
North Korea seems to be a special case.

In general, I don't believe anything that the government tells me about other countries threatening us.

But this seems to be the real deal.
Two years later your current assessment of the North Korea threat to us?

Vinny
It is much reduced thanks to Trump's diplomacy with respect to them.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by technovelist » Mon Jan 27, 2020 10:04 am

vnatale wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:34 pm
technovelist wrote:
Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:36 pm
Maddy wrote:
moda0306 wrote:Trump has no problem with the CIA, permanent war, gangster global capitalism, etc, as long as it's doing what he sees as being "in our interests" as they murder, torture, lie, steal, and secretly manipulate the public. He just wants to use these tools for less globalist aims. He's no enemy of the deep state. He just wants to use its power somewhat differently.
I'd be surprised if Trump fully understands, at this point, what the deep state is and what its objectives are. No doubt his learning curve has been steep, but he's had neither the time nor the experience to know what's really at stake, who's really running the show, and little information or control he has over anything. It may be that the oligarchy will, in the end, play him like a fiddle (as they have every president in recent history), but I think it's too early to brand him one way or another.
I think he understands exactly what the deep state is and what its objectives are.

If he can stay alive and avoid being railroaded out of office I believe he will go down as a great President.
He's just hit the 3/4's point of his first term. I don't even think I have to guess that you now already consider him to be a great President?

Vinny
Yes. He should be on Mount Rushmore instead of Abraham Lincoln, who was a total POS.
But actually there should be a mountain just for him, called "Mount Trumpmore". O0
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