New Zealand Mosque Shooting

[stuper1]

I really don't get this argument that since white people took over say America (or New Zealand or wherever) from the Indians hundreds of years ago that now the white people are morally obligated to let somebody else into this country. What about the Indians? Do you think they were the first ones here? Or did they take it over from somebody who was here before them? Are we supposed to work all the way back to the beginning to figure out who really "owns" the land.

That's ridiculous. Surely what we need to do is that whoever is in charge of the place now needs to run it as best they can. Does that mean letting in hordes of outsiders who aren't assimilating to the prevailing culture? I certainly don't think so. Did that work out well for the Indians? I don't think a lot of people really think about that hard enough. To some people this is what it feels like when they see things changing quickly. They want to defend what they have always known. This is just human nature. Would the Indians have been better off if they had the technology to fight back more effectively? Looking at where they are now, maybe the answer is "yes". So, where does that leave us? Hopefully not killing people, but voting for politicians that will slow down the immigration rate to a level where assimilation can occur better.

Again, I'm not defending the evil person who did the NZ killings. Obviously, he's a total scumbag. It just seems like some of the arguments to support even more immigration don't really add up.

Everybody says that we should learn from history or we will be doomed to repeat it. Look into history a bit. Has rapid mixing of diverse cultures ever worked out well before? I don't really know. I'm no great student of history. However, I think I know as much as most people about human nature, and what I know of human nature is that it has some very negative attributes (tribalism, etc.). Some people think that things are different now, and all we have to do is educate our youth on the great benefits of multi-culturalism, and all will be well. I'm not so sure. Maybe in 1,000 years, when there is only one culture and skin color left on Earth (brownish-yellow or whatever). But until then, we are in for some violent times.

[dualstow]

I learned something new.

But most fascinating is that the shooter cites Candace Owens as an inspiration. Over recent days the media has gone huge on this. Some readers will know that Owens is a prominent young black Republican Trump supporter, who is also one of the leaders of the student activist group Turning Point. In his manifesto the shooter says that he wants to credit Owens in particular for inspiring him. I am told by a colleague that this is a meme on far-right message boards associated with the ‘alt-right’ who like to troll Turning Point (who they hate for being pro-Israel, among other things) by endlessly, mockingly tipping their hat to them. The fact that the shooter says what he says about Candace Owens, and says that he knows that he must disavow some of her more extreme statements [his view] reads to me like a very clear attempt to target Candace Owens, whom he clearly hates. He wishes to send the mob after her. I am sorry to say that I think people have been played for suckers here, and the media have fallen into one of the traps that the killer laid for them.

from Who should we blame for the New Zealand atrocity?
Apart from the Christchurch gunman himself, it isn’t clear that anyone else is responsible for the massacre
by Douglas Murray

https://spectator.us/blame-new-zealand-atrocity/

[moda0306]

I learned something new.

But most fascinating is that the shooter cites Candace Owens as an inspiration. Over recent days the media has gone huge on this. Some readers will know that Owens is a prominent young black Republican Trump supporter, who is also one of the leaders of the student activist group Turning Point. In his manifesto the shooter says that he wants to credit Owens in particular for inspiring him. I am told by a colleague that this is a meme on far-right message boards associated with the ‘alt-right’ who like to troll Turning Point (who they hate for being pro-Israel, among other things) by endlessly, mockingly tipping their hat to them. The fact that the shooter says what he says about Candace Owens, and says that he knows that he must disavow some of her more extreme statements [his view] reads to me like a very clear attempt to target Candace Owens, whom he clearly hates. He wishes to send the mob after her. I am sorry to say that I think people have been played for suckers here, and the media have fallen into one of the traps that the killer laid for them.

from Who should we blame for the New Zealand atrocity?
Apart from the Christchurch gunman himself, it isn’t clear that anyone else is responsible for the massacre
by Douglas Murray

https://spectator.us/blame-new-zealand-atrocity/

That's a very convenient and unconvincing conclusion to come to as it pertains to the killer's words for Candace Owens. Though I wouldn't "blame" Owens, her veiled calls for violence aren't a whole lot more difficult to spot than Ted Nugent's.

[dualstow]

That's a very convenient and unconvincing conclusion to come to as it pertains to the killer's words for Candace Owens. Though I wouldn't "blame" Owens, her veiled calls for violence aren't a whole lot more difficult to spot than Ted Nugent's.

Oh, that may be, but I don't think the author is saying Candace Owens was trolled by the killer, therefore she is blameless. It's just an interesting part of an article which, overall says "I don't know who is to blame, but there is an awful lot of finger-pointing going on."