Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:55 pm

Libertarian666 wrote:
moda0306 wrote:
farjean2 wrote:
What are they?
Simply any topic where one would believe he has opinions or will make decisions that are dangerous for this country. For the most part, I'm talking about foreign policy, war powers, and law enforcement agency civil liberties issues where he has the most authority. But someone might disagree with me that these are extra important areas considering the president's outsised unilateral influence, or they might just care more about other issues.

So the facts might be simply the very unbalanced things he's said about these topics. Perhaps it's just facts about his apparent mental state when he controls our nuclear arsenal. Do I need to go re-find the quote where he suggested we surround ISIS in Iraq with troops and have our oil companies take all the oil? Suggesting executing Snowden? Suggested we kill families of terrorists? Suggested he's going to "do a lot worse" than waterboarding for torture? Killing civilians at a far-higher rate than Obama?

How about making nice with Henry Kissinger or the Saudis? How about the war crimes he's already commited? How about simply having a gross anti-civil libertarian like Sessions as attorney general? Bombing Syria? Continuing the war in Yemen?

These are just simple facts in a pretty narrow area of policy.

How about you folks... what things would you like to see Trump held accountable? Perhaps some of his promises, his general decorum or domestic policy priorities?

Or are we just going to sit here and bash Hillary's books?
No one can be held accountable for their opinions or decisions that people believe he would make. That doesn't even make sense.

Of course you can always have an opinion that someone else's opinion is wrong.

But that's not holding that person accountable; it's just your opinion.

Actions are the only thing for which anyone can be held accountable.

Yes, speech is a form of action, but it in itself does nothing unless it is a legal command to someone else to do something.

So then we have to ask which of Trump's actions he should be held accountable for.

Go ahead and let us know which actions you think he should be held accountable for; then we can have a possibly fruitful discussion.
Half of my examples were actual actions and not just opinions. Try them.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Michellebell » Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:03 pm

I've been a really busy mom lately and haven't had much time to really look deeply into Trump's foreign policies and everything...but you'd have to live under a rock to not notice that the media has gone INSANE recently over the most harmless things. It's been harder for me actually find the real issues because people are so bent out of shape over non-issues. Like, didn't we just have a major victory against ISIS? I could list so many examples of trivial news stories, but most recently Trump made a condolence call to a widow and the Florida congresswoman misinterpreted his words to make up this whole story about how he has no empathy. I thought that was insane. Trump has always been respectful to veterans but people are determined to hate him and twist his words to sound like he says things that he hasn't said. They did the same thing with his response to Charlottesville, I thought.

People on Facebook have unfriended me because I posted a few links that defended Trump over some issues that he has been slammed over. My mother said she'd be absolutely thrilled if he were assassinated. People are defending Antifa actually beating Trump supporters in the streets. His name has become basically a symbol of racism or Nazism to many people.

Now I'm not saying the man is perfect. People seem to either love him or hate him. I'm more unusual in that I'm more on the fence, at least for now. He hasn't been the President for long so I want to wait and see. Personally I like that he's not afraid to say what he thinks. It's definitely not "presidential," but I really don't care about that. Hillary sounds more "presidential" than Trump but I think she'd be horrible for our country. Seriously I feel like, if she were our leader for eight years we wouldn't have the Constitution anymore or something by the end of that. Also, I don't trust her AT ALL.

Actually I didn't vote in the last election (I know, that sounds horrible!) But I was pregnant with my fourth child and feeling really ill during the whole fall season. I couldn't handle paying attention to politics or spending any time reading online. All I knew was that everyone in my family hated Trump's guts, everyone I worked with hated him too, but I had a God-awful gut-wrenching bad feeling about Hillary. I didn't watch the debates or know enough to make a decision at the time, and I felt so uneasy about both candidates that I think I partially didn't vote to avoid voter regret. I didn't think Trump would stand a chance to win anyway also because of the way the media said that polls were in her favor. Nowadays I don't trust most media because it is so over-the-top negative. Just the wording that the reporters or editors use is so obviously biased. It's like they're not even trying to sound like news anymore.

Anyway, if Trump can turn our economy around and (although scary) use his more direct tactics and words to get some of the more violent world forces under control, then I will vote for him in 2020. I don't like the idea of being aggressive with other countries, but pacifism hasn't been working and there are some truly horrific things happening in the world right now.

As of right now, I try to give him the benefit of the doubt and support him because he IS our president. To me, he seems like he's working really hard and trying to follow through on his campaign promises. He's really swimming against the current with the way a lot of politicians are treating him too it seems. I've been posting some links on Facebook defending him, and some people just don't know what to think about me! Ha! I don't fit the mold of the stereotypical Trump supporter - uneducated, white, sexist, racist, bigoted male. I'm a college-educated Asian woman. Really, the vitriol that I received when I posted on Facebook a link about the Harvard study showing a 90% negative bias in the media about Trump, it was like I had blown peoples' faces off. Seriously! People I grew up with. It was like they were beyond baffled at what could have happened to me.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Maddy » Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:38 am

TennPaGa wrote:
Libertarian666 wrote: He authorized whatever was going on in Niger that ended up with 8 US military personnel getting killed. I thought Trump was going to keep the US out of that stuff. (I'm ashamed to admit that, for a time last summer, I actually believed he would follow through on getting the U.S. out of the Middle East. Boy, was I gullible.)
Google "Africom." Then take a look at the roster of private military, security, and natural resource-based monopoly corporations with a permanent footprint on that new frontier of economic resources. Finally, Google "General Wesley Clark" and look for the little bombshell he dropped in 2007 regarding the plan for establishing western hegemony in the mideast by eradicating seven specific nation states and their nationalistic leaders who are standing in the way of this plan.

The consider whether it's logical to believe that Trump is running this show.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:11 am

TennPaGa wrote:
Maddy wrote:
TennPaGa wrote:
Google "Africom." Then take a look at the roster of private military, security, and natural resource-based monopoly corporations with a permanent footprint on that new frontier of economic resources. Finally, Google "General Wesley Clark" and look for the little bombshell he dropped in 2007 regarding the plan for establishing western hegemony in the mideast by eradicating seven specific nation states and their nationalistic leaders who are standing in the way of this plan.

The consider whether it's logical to believe that Trump is running this show.
Donald Trump is President of the United States. Of course he is running the show.

Trump absolutely could get the U.S. out of Niger -- if he wanted to. But he doesn't want to, obviously.
That's all well and good... But on the other hand, someone defriended me. ::)
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Mountaineer » Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:17 am

Simonjester wrote:+ 1 wonderful post.
i have a similar on the fence view of trump, i am not a strong supporter, i question whether the in your face New yorker attitude (seldom understood outside NY city) works as presidential, i don't believe he is ANY of the things the media say about him, and i LOVE that the establishment (both sides) are having apoplectic fits over his very existence, regardless if he is a good bad or indifferent president, i think any even the smallest of pullback from the politics as usual that Hillary and his establishment republican enemies represent will be a good thing..
+2 re. Michellebell's post, and +1 for the Simonjester post. I may be all wet on this, but I think most, if not all, of the media is geared to appeal to EMOTION (aka sensationalism) rather than to diligently dig for facts and truth and then report objectively. I tend to put the media in the same box as soap opera, professional wrestling, and the evening "news" talking heads - not worth listening to or watching. As for the politicians, they are mainly just a bunch of self-serving narcisistic lost souls. Having said all that, the media and politicians are just serving up what most of the people want, and can't help wanting - entertainment that requires no effort other than picking up the remote. Some people excessively drink to escape, some do drugs, some are addicts of other flavors, some are even addicted to internet forums, some to TV, and some just stick with matters of personal importance.
DNA has its own language (code), and language requires intelligence. There is no known mechanism by which matter can give birth to information, let alone language. It is unreasonable to believe the world could have happened by chance.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:29 am

Anyone with the ability to think freely is annoyed and sickened by "the media." Enough using that as an excuse! Talk about a red-herring. "The media" may be informing establishment liberals and establishment conservatives. WHO CARES!? This isn't about "the media." This is about the areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, bombastic, dangerous or nefarious in his intentions.

Let's quit using it as a distraction or excuse from the corrupt murderers in various places within our government (yes, also within the deep state).

When Obama was president, good free-thinking adults didn't excuse him or ignore his crimes because "some of my conservative friends had absolutely sickening opinions of him, used sloppy logic, or embraced establishment conservative alt-media sources that were one-sided garbage propaganda." Anyone who would have quoted "but my friend blocked me on FB," would have been rightfully laughed at. Sure, plenty of "liberals" did. But let's rise above that shall we?

Unless we really want to pretend Trump is an anti-establishment threat to the deep-state or corruption, let's cut the f'king sh!t, shall we?

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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Xan » Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:44 am

Moda, you seem to be trotting out Henry Kissenger as some kind of boogeyman on a regular basis. Can you describe your thinking on that?
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:52 am

Xan wrote:Moda, you seem to be trotting out Henry Kissenger as some kind of boogeyman on a regular basis. Can you describe your thinking on that?
It's just a great example of him not being anti-establishment or a threat to the deep state. One of many.

Henry Kissinger is perhaps the poster-boy of late-20th century establishment US foreign policy. If it helps I can diversify my references a bit.

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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Maddy » Thu Oct 26, 2017 12:12 pm

TennPaGa wrote:Trump absolutely could get the U.S. out of Niger -- if he wanted to. But he doesn't want to, obviously.
Then it remains a real head-scratcher how the Pentagon could simply deny his request for information about foreign military involvements, as was reported to have occurred shortly after his inauguration.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by WiseOne » Thu Nov 02, 2017 7:25 am

Simonjester wrote:
moda0306 wrote: This is about the areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, bombastic, dangerous or nefarious in his intentions.

Unless we really want to pretend Trump is an anti-establishment threat to the deep-state or corruption, let's cut the f'king sh!t, shall we?
nobody is a threat to the deep deep state they are way too firmly in control, at best trump can be a threat to the politics as usual government expansionist establishment and the surface level deep state corruption and incompetence (and i hope he ends up being so and not just another empty political promise maker) hoping he can take on the banks and the MIC directly is completely unrealistic. working around the edges by keeping some of his promises would be the best realistic turnout we could hope for.
while i agree he is bombastic and that all politicians have their moments of incompetence trump included, (though i wouldn't begin to describe him as being incompetent in general..)

i don't see any evidence of him being the following, as an individual or a president
corrupt
dangerous
nefarious in his intentions
Taking this at face value...

How do you find out about areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, etc, when the main source of information you have is the media?

It takes a lot of effort to sift through the garbage to pull out nuggets of truth. I wish I had more time and energy for that, but my impression so far is that while Trump is not someone I would ever want to work for and at times has conducted himself in a manner unbefitting his office, he's not nearly as bad as the portrayal suggests.

Oddly, I've been thinking more about this since I start plowing through Ken Burns' "Vietnam" series on PBS. It is outstanding and well worth watching. The presentation paints a rather shocking portrait of self-delusion, rationalization, and gamesmanship in the US government & media that is if anything worse than what's going on today. The basis for the war was essentially made up. Originally it was about Vietnam trying to win independence from France, and the U.S. started out as - and could have remained - an ally. The "communism" label which somehow came into the picture turned out to be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Sound familiar?
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by stuper1 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:11 pm

Very well stated, WiseOne. A whole lot of people seem to want to dump on Trump as if he was Hitler, but they don't seem to consider that maybe the only reason they think he is Hitler is because the media wants them to think that.

Has anyone else seen this reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comm ... th_donald/

I haven't read all of the comments on it, but of the ones I have read from people who have actually met or dealt with Trump in real life, most of them seem to think he's not that bad of a guy.

People always say that a politician's personality shouldn't matter, only his/her policies. That doesn't only apply when the politician seems likable; it also applies when he/she seems unlikable (e.g., Trump). But it seems like Trump's detractors mainly want to talk about irrelevant personal traits that aren't really important, rather than discussing the big issues, one of which is ... of course ... immigration.

The whole Russia collusion business reminds me of nothing so much as the WMDs-in-Iraq debacle back in 2002.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Michellebell » Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:30 pm

WiseOne wrote:
How do you find out about areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, etc, when the main source of information you have is the media?

It takes a lot of effort to sift through the garbage to pull out nuggets of truth. I wish I had more time and energy for that, but my impression so far is that while Trump is not someone I would ever want to work for and at times has conducted himself in a manner unbefitting his office, he's not nearly as bad as the portrayal suggests.



Sound familiar?
Actually I saw some interviews of women who worked for Trump who said that he was a very fair and kind person to work for. With all the media craziness, it was really surprising for me to see that. But really they seemed very genuine. When I thought about it some more, I thought about how his businesses have been very successful. I think that a lot of people assume rich people only get rich through corruption, and of course there are many who have done that. But I also think that for a lot of them, they become rich because they are smart, fair, good bosses, inspire hard workers, and provide services or goods that are a benefit to people.

I'd agree that the media portrayals of him are terrible, probably worse than the media portrayals of some of the most murderous political figures and dictators in history. Just the fact that they are THAT bad makes me have a hard time believing them.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:31 pm

WiseOne wrote:
moda0306 wrote:Anyone with the ability to think freely is annoyed and sickened by "the media." Enough using that as an excuse! Talk about a red-herring. "The media" may be informing establishment liberals and establishment conservatives. WHO CARES!? This isn't about "the media." This is about the areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, bombastic, dangerous or nefarious in his intentions.
Taking this at face value...

How do you find out about areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, etc, when the main source of information you have is the media?

What is "the media?" If there's no source of current events you trust, then why do you come to arguments with facts about anything? You never seem to be quite this skeptical of the media on any other topic du jour... why now so much?

It takes a lot of effort to sift through the garbage to pull out nuggets of truth.

I totally agree. Trump makes it harder by telling so many lies so fast that his supporters don't even seem to care about what comes out of his mouth anymore.

I wish I had more time and energy for that, but my impression (Impression from what? What "the media" has shown you? Have you met the president or are you gleaning what you know from "the media?) so far is that while Trump is not someone I would ever want to work for and at times has conducted himself in a manner unbefitting his office, he's not nearly as bad as the portrayal suggests. What portrayal?
Is there only one? Does "authoritarian sexual-assaulting buffoon" count?


Oddly, I've been thinking more about this since I start plowing through Ken Burns' "Vietnam" series on PBS. It is outstanding and well worth watching. The presentation paints a rather shocking portrait of self-delusion, rationalization, and gamesmanship in the US government & media that is if anything worse than what's going on today. The basis for the war was essentially made up. Originally it was about Vietnam trying to win independence from France, and the U.S. started out as - and could have remained - an ally. The "communism" label which somehow came into the picture turned out to be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

You realize that "the media" essentially produced that documentary, right? Why believe one thing in it that so-called "documentary"? It's either hearsay or facts that "we don't have the time to pull out the nuggets of truth" out of.

Sound familiar?
I understand some of your frustration, but you are essentially saying that there is NO news source that is accurately calling Trump out in negative ways that you can identify. You aren't trying. Probably because you're not emotionally motivated to give liberals any sort of gratification when they hit a few decent points against the utter buffoon in control of nukes right now while you complain about "the media."
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:36 pm

Michellebell wrote:
WiseOne wrote:
How do you find out about areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, etc, when the main source of information you have is the media?

It takes a lot of effort to sift through the garbage to pull out nuggets of truth. I wish I had more time and energy for that, but my impression so far is that while Trump is not someone I would ever want to work for and at times has conducted himself in a manner unbefitting his office, he's not nearly as bad as the portrayal suggests.



Sound familiar?
Actually I saw some interviews of women who worked for Trump who said that he was a very fair and kind person to work for. With all the media craziness, it was really surprising for me to see that. But really they seemed very genuine. When I thought about it some more, I thought about how his businesses have been very successful. I think that a lot of people assume rich people only get rich through corruption, and of course there are many who have done that. But I also think that for a lot of them, they become rich because they are smart, fair, good bosses, inspire hard workers, and provide services or goods that are a benefit to people.

I'd agree that the media portrayals of him are terrible, probably worse than the media portrayals of some of the most murderous political figures and dictators in history. Just the fact that they are THAT bad makes me have a hard time believing them.
He's a complete slimeball. Quit blaming "the media." I don't need to listen to ANY establishment media commentary on him to know this and neither do you. And he's rich because of his daddy.

If liberals had elected Kanye West president, you people would be losing your f*king minds... and you'd probably be partially right to do so. Any attempt to blame "the media" for portrayals of him being an arrogant a$$hat would be laughable, and this forum would be rightfully deriding liberals as having gone beyond the pale in the garbage they're willing to put in office.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by stuper1 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 5:41 pm

moda0306 wrote:He's a complete slimeball.
Could you point us to the sources you have found most valuable in arriving at this opinion?
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 5:48 pm

Libertarian666 wrote:
moda0306 wrote:
I understand some of your frustration, but you are essentially saying that there is NO news source that is accurately calling Trump out in negative ways that you can identify. You aren't trying. Probably because you're not emotionally motivated to give liberals any sort of gratification when they hit a few decent points against the utter buffoon in control of nukes right now while you complain about "the media."
I'm still waiting for an explanation of how an "utter buffoon" could win the Presidency against the combined forces of:
1. 90% of the media
2. The Democratic establishment
3. The Republican establishment
4. The most feared political machine since Tammany Hall.

Want to give that a shot?
Because he's a celebrity, and stroked the anti-establishment and jingoistic wing of the R's to win the nomination, Hillary Clinton was a terrible candidate, and "the media" wanted ratings so they gave him airtime. It was only negative insofar as he consistently made an ass of himself.

The Republican (and dem, really) establishment will do just fine with him. He's falling right in line, absent being a complete buffoon, but I've always said that Republicans would give a monkey the white house if they'd sign a tax cut for them. Didn't think I'd live to see the day.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 5:58 pm

stuper1 wrote:
moda0306 wrote:He's a complete slimeball.
Could you point us to the sources you have found most valuable in arriving at this opinion?
A massive amount of what comes out of his mouth is pure slime-ball material. The best of what he says is at-best neutral. I mean I've HEARD he's done shady things, but those are hearsay and unlike some folks I don't believe everything I hear that confirms my suspicions.

Keep in mind, slime-ball isn't an objective, factual term. It's describes a repulsive person. I find him repulsive. It's up to interpretation. Yes, even when Lou Dobbs is slobbing all over him I also find him repulsive (more-so in-fact) than usual. This has nothing to do with politics (his authoritarian attitude also bothers me). Just how he behaves as a person. We can all sit around here and pretend that he's just a bit bombastic and anti-establishment. Or we can call him what he is... a rapey, braggadocios, serial-lying, embarassment of a f'king human being to have in any position of power, much less over our nuclear arsenal.

And yes... Hillary is also a slime-ball in her own way, but most of those have to do with being a Richard Nixon-esque figure. Not the next coming of Chairman Mao.

But you don't see half the people on this board ever having said anything remotely supportive of Hillary. In-fact I don't think I've seen one positive thing said about her or in defense of her on this board. Like I said... if half of us were supporting or defending or blaming "the media" during a Kanye West presidency, I'd be equally dumbfounded. And the asinine amount of ridicule some would receive would be well-deserved.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 6:04 pm

Libertarian666 wrote:
Michellebell wrote:
WiseOne wrote:
How do you find out about areas where Trump is corrupt, incompetent, dishonest, etc, when the main source of information you have is the media?

It takes a lot of effort to sift through the garbage to pull out nuggets of truth. I wish I had more time and energy for that, but my impression so far is that while Trump is not someone I would ever want to work for and at times has conducted himself in a manner unbefitting his office, he's not nearly as bad as the portrayal suggests.



Sound familiar?
Actually I saw some interviews of women who worked for Trump who said that he was a very fair and kind person to work for. With all the media craziness, it was really surprising for me to see that. But really they seemed very genuine. When I thought about it some more, I thought about how his businesses have been very successful. I think that a lot of people assume rich people only get rich through corruption, and of course there are many who have done that. But I also think that for a lot of them, they become rich because they are smart, fair, good bosses, inspire hard workers, and provide services or goods that are a benefit to people.

I'd agree that the media portrayals of him are terrible, probably worse than the media portrayals of some of the most murderous political figures and dictators in history. Just the fact that they are THAT bad makes me have a hard time believing them.
The media, with just one exception, have been lying their asses off about Trump ever since he got the nomination of the Republican party.

A number of them, including CNN, NBC, the Washington Post and MSNBC, have been caught red-handed making stuff up.

But those who hate Trump don't care. He's "literally Hitler" to them, and anyone who thinks he is even slightly better than that is a moron, a bigot, and whatever other pejoratives they can think of.

This is why he was elected, and why he will be re-elected if things continue the way they have been.

So keep it up, Trump-haters! You're doing exactly what you need to do to help him!
Quit putting out this bullsh!t excuse. Plenty of people haven't called him "literally H!tler." Many, many people find him to be a rapey slimeball authoritarian embarassment. THAT is the accurate accusation, and I'd love to see you, a so called f*king anarchist, to try to defend this authoritarian statist against THOSE accusations.

Trump has also been lying his ass off. "The media" isn't our president. Trump is. Do you find him to be an honest person? I believe you've answered this question "yes," before. Own that one more time in front of us all, please...

I don't hate Trump. I find him repulsive. Adults realize the difference. Children pretend to be anarchists while defending an authoritarian-leaning shit-stain on human history who's grabbed you by the p*ssy and apparently won't let go.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Michellebell » Thu Nov 02, 2017 7:10 pm

With all the stuff that I've seen, it sounds like Trump is more honest than most politicians we've seen lately. And as far as treatment of women, Bill Clinton has been the most sexist president of recent years. Also, Hillary was treating those women pretty badly too. So here she claims to be all for women's rights but when her husband mistreated women, she went against them. Trump apologized for that conversation and I've seen no evidence that he's ever actually done anything like assault or sexually harass women.

But women have been having a lot of fun with wearing the p*ssy hats and marching on Washington. My sister-in-law voted for Trump but then her mother hopped on a bus and marched to protest with a bunch of women. I think she just did it to go along with the crowd and have a fun time. Seriously I don't know what she was fighting for. I'm interested to see what happens with the economy, jobs, terrorist attacks, North Korea, etc. over the next eight years. RIght now there are lot of difficult problems our country is facing, but even if Trump ultimately does a lot of good for our country, he'll be seen as nothing more than a p*ssy grabber to many people I'm sure.

I also don't remember any women marching in Washington after all the scandal was revealed with Bill Clinton, but please correct me if I'm wrong. I do remember a lot of people defending him. I was only in high school at the time.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Maddy » Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:05 am

I have difficulty even understanding the characterization of Trump as "rapey," although this image appears to be almost obsessively dominating the thinking of the disgruntled Left.

The particular comment that has sent the Left into high worble has nothing to do with rape, nor does it convey a disrespectful attitude toward women generally. The comment related specifically to the hoards of gold-digging women--essentially high-priced hookers--who wouldn't think of getting an actual job but who would open their legs on a dime for a billionaire real estate mogul. Trump's attitude toward these women was, in my view, appropriately disrespectful. He knew what their game was.

Likewise, the women who threw themselves at Trump for a chance to claw their way to the top knew what the game was and believed that they possessed sufficient sexual power to win it. These women were not victims.

Trump, unlike the majority of his predecessors to the White House, actually has a reputation for treating women very well. Unlike many of his predecessors, he appears to actually like and respect competent, professional women.

If there was even one comment from Trump that suggested something non-consensual, I would rethink my position on this.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:28 am

Maddy,

Here you are...
I moved on her, and I failed. I'll admit it.

I did try and fuck her. She was married.

And I moved on her very heavily. In fact, I took her out furniture shopping. She wanted to get some furniture. I said, "I'll show you where they have some nice furniture." I took her out furniture—I moved on her like a bitch. But I couldn't get there. And she was married.

I better use some Tic Tacs just in case I start kissing her. You know I'm automatically attracted to beautiful—I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.

Grab 'em by the pussy. You can do anything
.
Before a show, I’ll go backstage and everyone’s getting dressed, and everything else, and you know, no men are anywhere, and I’m allowed to go in because I’m the owner of the pageant and therefore I’m inspecting it. You know, I’m inspecting because I want to make sure that everything is good. You know, they’re standing there with no clothes. ‘Is everybody okay?’ And you see these incredible looking women, and so, I sort of get away with things like that.
And about his daughter...
Yeah, she’s really something, and what a beauty, that one. If I weren’t happily married and, ya know, her father . . .
... with regards to her posing for playboy...
It would be really disappointing — not really — but it would depend on what’s inside the magazine. I don’t think Ivanka would do that, although she does have a very nice figure. I’ve said if Ivanka weren’t my daughter, perhaps I’d be dating her.
This is what he has actually SAID. Of course, the several rape allegations along-side this can't be proven any more than the positive hearsay that you choose to believe. If all I go on is how this guy willingly presents himself to the public, he is a complete slimeball. Some of it is how he communicates non-verbally. Like a smarmy used-car-salesman.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Maddy » Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:46 am

I don't see anything remotely "rapey" about any of that. In fact, it's exactly the kind of banter to which I was exposed on a daily basis while working in a field dominated by men.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by moda0306 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:53 am

Libertarian666 wrote:
Maddy wrote:I have difficulty even understanding the characterization of Trump as "rapey," although this image appears to be almost obsessively dominating the thinking of the disgruntled Left.

The particular comment that has sent the Left into high worble has nothing to do with rape, nor does it convey a disrespectful attitude toward women generally. The comment related specifically to the hoards of gold-digging women--essentially high-priced hookers--who wouldn't think of getting an actual job but who would open their legs on a dime for a billionaire real estate mogul. Trump's attitude toward these women was, in my view, appropriately disrespectful. He knew what their game was.

Likewise, the women who threw themselves at Trump for a chance to claw their way to the top knew what the game was and believed that they possessed sufficient sexual power to win it. These women were not victims.

Trump, unlike the majority of his predecessors to the White House, actually has a reputation for treating women very well. Unlike many of his predecessors, he appears to actually like and respect competent, professional women.

If there was even one comment from Trump that suggested something non-consensual, I would rethink my position on this.
There seems to be a very high incidence of mental illness among the disgruntled Left.

As well as among a number of people who probably wouldn't describe themselves that way but who get all of their "news" from the "mainstream media".

There is no point in discussing anything with such people, other than for the edification of normal people who don't yet understand the raging epidemic of Trump Derangement Syndrome. I know I found it hard to believe at first myself.
Funny how this "derangement" also exists among many people who are not of "the left."
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by Libertarian666 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 10:02 am

By the way, moda306, I have added you to my ignore list.

But to show that I don't have any hard feelings, I will mention that you should get help for your anger problem. The level of rage you are displaying is bad for your health.
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Re: Hillary's new book: "It Was My Turn"

Post by stuper1 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 10:27 am

Moda, you've used the word "authoritarian" several times to describe Trump. Could you tell us which of his actions you find as displaying authoritarianism? I ask this out of true curiosity, not as any type of "gotcha" question. I just want to know, because I don't really see that.

By the way, I totally agree with you on your characterization of him as a smarmy, used-car-salesman type of guy. No argument there at all.
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