Trump as tragicomedy

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shekels
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by shekels » Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:48 am

dualstow wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 5:59 am
stuper1 wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:47 pm
That's a good one. And yet we'll have to put up with the same people preaching to us that Trump is an outrageous threat to free speech when he calls them "fake news". Anybody who believes anything fed to them by the mainstream media deserves everything they get.
lol. What do they get?
"1984" :-\ We are getting to see 1984 in slow motion. Where facts are being scrubbed from the Internet, and propaganda taking it's place.
https://www.qwant.com/
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by stuper1 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:37 pm

Cortopassi wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:21 am
What is the pejorative "mainstream" media? ABC, NBC, CBS, and I assume FOX and CNN as well?

Or is it whatever media that doesn't have your point of view?

I hate the discourse in this country lately.
I'd say for practical purposes that "mainstream media" basically means anything that reaches your eyeballs or ears easily, meaning that you don't have to dig for it a bit. Thus mainstream media includes all the sources listed above, including Fox.

Of course, as is well known, the problem with the mainstream media is that it's controlled by big business. The problem with that is that the interests of big business are generally unaligned with the interests of me, an upper middle class American. And how could they be aligned? Big business isn't even a person, except as a legal fiction. Really the only interest of big business is to make money. My interests as a human being are much wider than that. And even and especially in the sphere of money, big businesses interests are often unaligned with my interests.

All I'm saying is that we should all take essentially everything we hear from just about any news source with a huge grain of salt. Of course, we all know that, but then we get busy with our lives and sort of forget it, and before you know it we're commenting about some news story and hardly stopping to wonder whether what the story says is in fact correct and not hugely skewed. We may think, "Oh, this news story has little to do with something that big business is interested in, so therefore there's no reason to think that it could be biased," when in fact, if we thought about it a bit deeper, we would realize that big business does have an interest in that subject and the story very well may be biased.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by jacksonM » Wed Jul 24, 2019 1:04 pm

Things could be a lot worse as far as the MSM goes.

Back in the old days all we had was the evening news on CBS, ABC, and NBC and publications like Time Magazine and Newsweek. The liberal bias was palpable.

When Cable and FoxNews came along it was therefore like a breath of fresh air for a paleo-conservative/libertarian like myself (for lack of a better description). No, I don't agree with everything they say on Fox and their bias in the other direction is obvious but I think they give more air time to other points of view than any other network does.

Liberals don't seem to like this and I get the impression they would rather go back to the way it used to be.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by stuper1 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 1:16 pm

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:37 am
What's the saying... The news used to tell you that something happened, then you had to decide what you thought about it. Now the news tells you how to think about something, and you have to figure out if it even happened.
That's awesome and sounds pretty accurate to me.

jacksonM wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 1:04 pm
Things could be a lot worse as far as the MSM goes.

Back in the old days all we had was the evening news on CBS, ABC, and NBC and publications like Time Magazine and Newsweek. The liberal bias was palpable.

When Cable and FoxNews came along it was therefore like a breath of fresh air for a paleo-conservative/libertarian like myself (for lack of a better description). No, I don't agree with everything they say on Fox and their bias in the other direction is obvious but I think they give more air time to other points of view than any other network does.

Liberals don't seem to like this and I get the impression they would rather go back to the way it used to be.
I think that big business has both "conservatives" and "liberals" in their back pockets.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by sophie » Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:13 pm

Yah, I don't think that what we're seeing in the mainstream press has a lot to do with business interests. Otherwise they'd be a lot more favorable to Trump. I think it's more of a group ideology that somehow got disconnected from reality, and then moved on from there. It's got more in common with a fundamentalist religious cult than to any rational, self-serving set of interests.

In all fairness, the Right is just as susceptible to these things as the Left. Remember the bad old days of Jerry Falwell and the Moral Majority?
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by stuper1 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:05 pm

Well ... to give a couple obvious examples:

1. Trump (says he) wants to lower the immigration rate. For big business, the higher the immigration rate the better because it means more consumers and more cheap labor.

2. Trump (says he) wants to keep us out of more military conflicts. For big business, the more wars the better because each time we say shoot off a missile, that's another $1M in the pockets of some big defence contractor.

And then layer on top of that the quasi-religious aspect that Sophie mentioned and things just get worse.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:11 pm

sophie wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:13 pm
Yah, I don't think that what we're seeing in the mainstream press has a lot to do with business interests. Otherwise they'd be a lot more favorable to Trump.
How are you reaching that conclusion?
There are several thousand nearly complete viral genomes integrated into the human genome, most now inert or missing a crucial gene. These account for 1.3% of the entire genome. That may not sound like much, but 'proper' genes account for only 3%. If you think being descended from apes is bad for your self-esteem, then get used to the idea that you are also descended from viruses.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by sophie » Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:29 am

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:11 pm
sophie wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:13 pm
Yah, I don't think that what we're seeing in the mainstream press has a lot to do with business interests. Otherwise they'd be a lot more favorable to Trump.
How are you reaching that conclusion?
Big corporate tax cut? Deregulation? Anti-union and minimum wage stance? HELLO???

Obviously not everything he does is aligned with big business interests: tariffs, anti global free trade, anti illegal immigration, price transparency in health care etc. But on balance, big business would be way worse off with Democrats running the show: proposals for new wealth tax, Medicare for all, increased taxes on "the rich" and corporations, increased regulation.
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by Kriegsspiel » Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:47 am

sophie wrote:
Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:29 am
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:11 pm
sophie wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:13 pm
Yah, I don't think that what we're seeing in the mainstream press has a lot to do with business interests. Otherwise they'd be a lot more favorable to Trump.
How are you reaching that conclusion?
Big corporate tax cut? Deregulation? Anti-union and minimum wage stance? HELLO???

Obviously not everything he does is aligned with big business interests: tariffs, anti global free trade, anti illegal immigration, price transparency in health care etc. But on balance, big business would be way worse off with Democrats running the show: proposals for new wealth tax, Medicare for all, increased taxes on "the rich" and corporations, increased regulation.
Ahh, I wasn't even thinking along those lines. I thought you meant they would write nicer things about him instead of writing hit pieces and taking advantage of the (perceived) Trumpbumps.
There are several thousand nearly complete viral genomes integrated into the human genome, most now inert or missing a crucial gene. These account for 1.3% of the entire genome. That may not sound like much, but 'proper' genes account for only 3%. If you think being descended from apes is bad for your self-esteem, then get used to the idea that you are also descended from viruses.
Ridley, Genome
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Sun Jan 26, 2020 9:44 pm

Cortopassi wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:02 am
It has gone from hopeful to tragic for me. Sometimes funny, sure. The guy has a huge ego that seems to need to be stroked daily. I suppose I knew that, but now on full display, I regret that I had to make this choice.

I wish I had an opportunity to vote for Bernie.
You may well have that opportunity in November!

But, again, for me if it comes down to Bernie vs. Trump, I'm going with the best third party candidate available. I don't want either of those two!

After hearing Bloomberg speak today, I'd gladly choose him over those two. Just wish he wasn't so ancient!

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Sun Jan 26, 2020 9:55 pm

Mountaineer wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:54 pm
Trump is certainly not my personal idea of a role model .... but, you know me, I place God's will above mans' sinful corrupted view of how things should be according to our fallen and cursed reason. To the best of my knowledge, Trump has not required us to go against any of God's Word. So:

LOVING YOUR NEIGHBOR
#16 Parents and other authority figures in church and society deserve love, respect, and obedience because God has set them over us as his representatives. In the event that they command us to do something contrary to God’s Word, then we must obey God and disobey their command.
#17 Secular governments are instituted by God to maintain peace and order on earth. Therefore Christians should always respect their leaders as God’s representatives and should pray for them. Christians may serve in government and may work to improve government.
To the best of your knowledge, did Obama require us to go against any of God's Word? If not, then did you obey the rest you posted?

I'm guessing that its 25% you say that Obama didn't, 75% you say he did. And, that in the subsequent 2 1/2 years since you wrote the above that it is 100% that you say that Trump still has not.

And, I acknowledge there is zero black and white in all of this. When it comes to Biblical interpretation there are all kinds of judgments and reasonable people differ on those judgments. If there were not these differences, then there would not have been be so many different Christian denominations that developed from the story of just one man's life (and his followers) as told in just one book (albeit with many chapters).

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Trump as tragicomedy

Post by vnatale » Sun Jan 26, 2020 9:59 pm

I Shrugged wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:08 pm
I call him The Accidental President.

I don't think he thought he would win anything. He hooked a whale and couldn't let go as it pulled him into the abyss. By this time he must be thinking what the hell did I do?

I can go along with it being tragicomedy, for sure.
If you stayed up all the way until 4 AM (as I did) on Election night and saw him come out to give his victory speech you would have seen that your first sentence was definitely true. You could clearly see that he himself was totally shocked that he'd actually won!

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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