College is Overrated

[Pointedstick]

She learns virtually nothing from books on her own. I think that is probably normal but what to do about college and the shrinking pool of decent jobs?

To me, this sounds like a promising student for a vocational track rather than wasting money on a useless liberal arts degree that doesn't help job security.  Geeks have inherited the earth and they're not the kind that don't learn from books.  Trying to compete with them when you're not capable of it seems really foolish.

I want to go back to this because I don't think MG's comment got enough attention, and he's absolutely right. There is no point competing with people who love book learning if you don't. You'll lose, they'll win, and you'll feel bad about yourself and develop an inferiority complex until you leave that world.

Vocational work and the construction trades can be great choices. The lady who did some electrical work in my house makes more than I do on an hourly basis. She's great. The trades--especially ones that don't require large amount of physical strength, can work well for a tough and slightly tomboyish woman. Think electrician, plumber, gas worker ($$$$$ here), HVAC tech, bobcat operator, car mechanic, plasterer, etc. These are easy to learn fields that someone with a penchant for hands-on experience can master quickly, and hourly wages can run $30-100 easy, more in rich liberal places where clueless upper class folks who have never done real labor can be outrageously gouged. You're in CT, right? Perfect!

On the other hand, sexism is a major problem there because a lot of the lower-class men in these fields don't respect women and are dismayed to see them doing traditionally male labor. Knowing Spanish is helpful, too.

[Mountaineer]

I'm going to bump this topic because I'm heading towards an important life decision about college.

A little introduction:
Graduating this summer in a bachelor Business/Communication with one job offer already on the table.

After reading this topic I realized I went for the wrong decisions four years ago. I didn't know what to do back then, so I picked something and now I feel I wasted four years of time with a degree. The cost in Belgium is not that high for education so I'm not going to calculate the total cost (probably less than 5k) but the degree itself never helped me with the internship. I learned almost everything on my own in my free time and I even learned some extra skills like Audio Production at a semi-pro level, Coding and computer science.

I know I shouldn't waste too much time on thinking about the past and start taking action.
The options that I have now:

• Take the job and work towards starting my own business. I've got the plan and the skills, the only thing left is money, but I do lose a lot of time.
• I got the opportunity (and skills) to study a subject where the pay is a lot higher (with minimal costs) to be "Well Off". This is not going to stop me starting my own business later on. This will give me 'relatively' more time but less money.

Question for the older guys: Is it sometimes better to just set yourself a goal and start doing it instead of wandering around like most college students without any goals? I wouldn't have gone to college and do stuff different, but unfortunately time isn't reversible so we got to deal with the situation now!

Again, sorry for the bump.

I'm one of those old guys you are asking.  I don't mean to be trite, but before you pick a "goal" centered around "doing" and just plunge in, you will be well served to decide what you wish to "become" and what you wish to "be".  Then, by all means pick goals and go for them with gusto.  And for becoming and being, I would not limit myself to thinking only about physical activity or material things - for example, you may decide being happy, or being creative, or being a great spouse, is way more important than having a boatload of cash on hand, or not.  I have known far too many people who focus on the doing before the being and becoming - the outcome is usually predictable - they end up in a career they think is mostly drudgery, make unhappy miserable fathers and mothers, and in general are not a lot of fun to be around.  They also tend to spend a lot of time in the bar trying to escape their miserable jobs.  I realize that sounds cynical, but the principle is "ready, aim, fire"  or perhaps "measure twice, saw once".  Best wishes for your next phase of life. 

... Mountaineer

[Pointedstick]

Take that job offer, I say. Do it for a while and see if you like it. If you do, perfect! Keep at it until you don't. If you don't, then use the income that the job is providing you to set yourself up for an easy transition into the next thing, or going back to school with renewed focus. There's nothing like spending time in the private sector to give you perspective.

Wait, what?
College is overrated but you are suggesting more school [and the accompanying more debt]?

To be clear: I'm recommending to RobJ that he take the job offer rather than going back to school. I'm suggesting that going back to school would be something that would only make more sense after some time spent in the real world to temper him a bit and put the benefits and costs of more education in perspective. Rob also lives in Belgium and apparently school costs are low so that takes some of the pressure off. It's more about wasted time than wasted money.

[I Shrugged]

RobJ,

It's hard to say.  I always tend to think a job is the best choice, because it gives you more options as you begin to figure it out.  And it gives you experience, as PS said.

[RobJ]

Great replies guys! I'm going to think about it after my second internship (finishing in four weeks) and take a good look at the options. I'm starting to love this forum! 

The personality that I have (call it good or bad) is that I always like to finish what I've started. If I would take the job offer (which is a position in a digital marketing agency) I already start thinking about becoming the best guy in that scene (Belgium, Europe, Worldwide) according to a plan or start my own agency. I can't think about something without having a clear goal (sometimes the impossible, but I don't like that word either) and a strategy to make it work. Just 'having a job' and 'earning money' sounds (and excuse my language) boring as fuck to me.

Second option would be different: take the job for the money (and play it smart) and use all my free time to start my audio business.

Like I said: I'm going to think about what I want to "become", start taking action towards that and let the other ideas rest until I've finished what I've started now.

[Greg]

I'm starting to love this forum! 

This is the best forum I've ever been on. These guys and gals will certainly give you a lot of advice, but obviously it is up to you for what works best for you.

[vnatale]

Thanks for your input, PS & WiseOne!

WiseOne, I like the idea of internships and am trying to push our daughter in that direction for this summer (the one between her junior and senior years of high school).

PS, I'll go with options 1,3 & 4! I love the idea of gap years and think they can also be beneficial just in terms of a kid getting a break in their studies. And getting real world experience can only be a plus.

Option 3 is the path we have been planning on more or less, positioning assets and jumping through other hoops... just playing the damn game the way it is set up. But the kid still needs to be employable when she graduates, right?

Being Chinese my wife talks openly about all kinds of things that are not necessarily PC, and option 4 is one that she has put out there many times. Whether male or female, a person has better odds of meeting a future high earner at a high-powered school. Of course high-earning women don't tend to latch onto low-earning men, but we are not worried here about how the world maybe should work!

It is now almost 5 years later. I may never read in a subsequent post what happened. If your daughter went straight to college, she'd be graduating this year. What has happened since the above?

Vinny

[I Shrugged]

Now I should update my thoughts to include what a scam are post grad programs which produce highly paid professors whose worth to both the institution training them and the one hiring them is measured by how many research papers they get published, and in which journals. And this is in accounting! So my adult child, CPA, who wanted to teach accounting, not do research, had to waste five years in a PhD program where most of the time is spent researching. And nobody reads the research. I’m serious.

Many of these profs hardly ever teach a class. Instead they produce the aforementioned barely-read research. For a salary of $200k plus. If they get enough of it published in the best journals, they get tenure. If not, move on and keep grinding. Or maybe they give up and teach. (The horror.).

Should a graduate of a higher end program want to teach, and not research, from the start of their first job, as my child did, their training school will scold them for hurting the reputation of the program. They are supposed to get a job at an equally prestigious research school. Not teach (still at $200k plus) at a (gasp) non research school.

God bless the child for persevering and becoming a prof, but it’s all a racket. How many millions of dollars are wasted this way? Oh well.