Gyroscopic Investing

Just wanted to post some feedback.  Been using the regimen, especially the chlorine based rinse most religiously, and it has helped a lot.

Thanks again!

TennPaGa wrote: Ask and you shall be glued.

I asked MT but never heard back from him.  Has he absconded his moderator duties?

Benko wrote:Just wanted to post some feedback.  Been using the regimen, especially the chlorine based rinse most religiously, and it has helped a lot.

Thanks again!

Are you able to use the CloSys twice a day without negative taste effects?

MachineGhost wrote:

Benko wrote:Just wanted to post some feedback.  Been using the regimen, especially the chlorine based rinse most religiously, and it has helped a lot.

Thanks again!

Are you able to use the CloSys twice a day without negative taste effects?

Yes, twice a day is not a problem.  Either straight, or diluted in water, closys has little taste. 

On my most energetic days, I put however much closys they suggest FOR THIS USE, diluted in warm water in my waterpick and irrigate undergumline and between teeth.  Then brush.  The do same thing i.e. diluted listerene and irrigate between teeth and under gumline.  Then rince with the fluoride red stuff that I forget name of.  Floss sometimes.

Sometimes just closys with waterpik or just closys rinse + brushing.  Varies.

Of interest, here's the world's first dental citizen science campaign.  We'll put MangoMan out of business, yet!

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ubio ... icrobiome/

I tried a WaterPik recently and it seems to have cracked two of my fillings. Dentists must love these things!

It's not impossible.  It happened. The fillings might have been weakened but if they were I certainly didn't know it. I used the Waterpik for 4 days and needed emergency dental care twice. Don't you love it when the experts deny the facts to suit their own reality?

Two dental emergencies within 4 days of using the Waterpik. Two cracked fillings. Two payments to my dentist.

MangoMan wrote:

Reub wrote: Two dental emergencies within 4 days of using the Waterpik. Two cracked fillings. Two payments to my dentist.

Yep, that's proof. 

Since you are such a stickler for the scientific method, where is your absolute "proof" that it positively doesn't damage teeth or fillings beyond your own personal experience?

I see that your unequivocal proof is available on the Waterpik website. Nice!

Besides being information disseminated by Waterpik themselves, the studies examined inflammation,  gingivitis,  pocket depth, and flora. Nowhere was there a study mentioned of damage caused by Waterpiks vis a vis trauma to teeth and existing fillings.

Reub wrote: Two dental emergencies within 4 days of using the Waterpik. Two cracked fillings. Two payments to my dentist.

Reub,

Fillings are metal. Cracking a filling with a waterpick? very unlikely.  Look at basic principles.  how do you take a firehose and crack a metal brick.  I suppose if you could narrow the firehose spray to a very narrow stream and hold it at 1 tiny point on the metal brick for a long long time, something bad might happen eventually, but that is not how they are used.

The filling was almost certainly already bad and you probably cracked them from biting down on something.

I've been using a waterpick for years without problem.  Mine has a volume control and I have the volume set fairly low, but it does the job of getting rid of the food, etc., so it works fine for me.

You may not believe it, but unless you're doing something really silly with the waterpick, there is no way those filling were not bad already and it was just a coincidence.

i lost my teeth through the years from being pre  diabetic  so i have all implants at this point .  over the last 8 years i had 11 put in and i rejected 5 .

hoping the latest take well . i hate going through this as well as the cost each time .

I gave this a try for a few months, and tried continuing w/out the Closys because it's so damn expensive. I've found that I can't live w/out the Closys now.

Is there a generic version of Closys?

Jack Jones wrote: I gave this a try for a few months, and tried continuing w/out the Closys because it's so damn expensive. I've found that I can't live w/out the Closys now.

Is there a generic version of Closys?

The CloSys is what helps prevent gum pockets although it won't go past 3mm deep as I've learned from sore experience.  The regime is NOT a substitute for flossing despite what Dr. Zellie says, again as I've learned from sore experience.  It may depend on how crowded together your teeth are or how often you visit a hygienist for them to do the work.

You can get two prints of a coupon for $2 off at the CloSys website once every month to help with the cost.  And Walmart normally sells it the cheapest unless there is a sale there or elsewhere.  You can stack the sake with the coupons.  Since the coupons are usually good for 6 months, you can buy in bulk if you strike just right.

There's no generic version.  The wetting agent is what is proprietary about it.  I only use it once a day at night because more than that and it affects my sense of taste too negatively.  In the morning I use salt water or baking soda for the prebrush rinse.

Also, I recommend this instead of flossing or those overpriced, underpowered Water Pick devices: http://oralbreeze.com/
(Yes, "authorities" say its not a substitute for flossing either, but give me a break!)

Jack Jones wrote: I gave this a try for a few months, and tried continuing w/out the Closys because it's so damn expensive. I've found that I can't live w/out the Closys now.

Is there a generic version of Closys?

I would recommend that you ask your dentist.

Just bought a new waterpik and it did cost me $60 (probably are cheaper ones), but the nice thing is you can add the listerene or closys to the waterpik reservoir and use that to irrigate your mouth.

MangoMan wrote: As expected, Listerine and Crest Pro-Health demonstrated complete kill on all bacteria exposed within one minute. Breath Rx exhibited the weakest levels of bactericidal effects overall. CloSYS and chlorhexidine rinses proved identical 100% kills against the periodontal pathogens at five minutes; in some cases, CloSYS oral rinse achieved a higher kill at the one-minute mark over the chlorhexidine rinse.

It seems like there would be no benefit to using both, but I've definitely noticed a difference in breath quality after ceasing Closys use.

Well, at least the regime is working!  Just to be safe I think I'll start taking in some dental probiotics afterwards.

[img width=800]http://i.imgur.com/ZVURhtL.png[/img]

[img width=800]http://i.imgur.com/rik4c9B.png[/img]

Jack Jones wrote: It seems like there would be no benefit to using both, but I've definitely noticed a difference in breath quality after ceasing Closys use.

Since I used to be a non-meat eater at one time, I'm very sensitive to noticing "dragon breath" in myself and others.  I've observed that just doing the full routine with tongue scraping is not enough for complete knockout.  A substantial reduction of about, 80%, yes.  But for complete knockout you need to do this additional step: tilt your head back and deep throat gargle with the Listerine for a full 30 seconds after you're done doing the 1-min with your teeth.  Please use water to dilute if necessary because Listerine can burn incredibly painfully.  I get a proto-fainting feeling from the pain every time.

It also helps if you eat the correect servings of alkalizing/detoxing vegetables.  If you just eat an unbalanced meat heavy and carb-type meal and too close to bedtime, you're just gonna reek it up all night into your esophagus and throat.  The body "digests" meat by letting it literally rot.  So I don't think most people or dentists understand that "bad breath" is not just coming from bacteria in the mouth, it's coming from rotting fermentation and bacteria in the gastrointestinal tract.  People with "dogshit breath" have poor diets to say the least.

MangoMan wrote: Can you provide a source for this? Current theory [at least in the dental world] is that volatile sulfur compounds on the back half of the top of the tongue cause the vast majority of halitosis.

Naw, its empirical and clinical not academic.

I have updated, enhanced and edited the regime in the OP.

http://gyroscopicinvesting.com/forum/ot ... re-regime/

Good news! I have confirmed that Listerine Zero works as a replacement for original Listerine that contains alcohol. So no longer do you have to put up with the burn nor having your taste buds killed off. It is just as acidic too so that the last step works properly. Oddly though, some bottles do not list the essentials oils among the inactive ingredients and no bottle that I've seen ever lists them under active ingredients.

The evidence in support of flossing is weak at best, and probably non-existent:

Weak, unreliable evidence suggests flossing plus toothbrushing may be associated with a small reduction in plaque
http://www.nature.com/ebd/journal/v13/n ... 0835a.html

The Medical Benefit of Daily Flossing Called Into Question
http://www.ada.org/en/science-research/ ... o-question

When I heard this news I decided to try an experiment: I went between dental cleanings (4 months) without flossing once. Instead, I doubled the length of time I brushed my teeth (in essence, using the time when I would have been flossing to instead keep brushing).

Normally I get an admonition from my dentist to floss twice a day because the hygienist found a certain amount of plaque or tartar along my gum line. (Note: A few years ago I had 2 gum surgeries and a bone graft in a portion of my jaw due to receding gums).

After my 4-moth experiment, at my next check-up I got no admonition! Instead, the dentist said "Looks great! Keep up the good work!"

I realize this is anecdotal evidence, but I was truly surprised that neither the hygienist nor my dentist detected that I had not flossed my teeth for an entire 4 months.

P.S. - I should mention that I brush twice daily: in the mornings with a manual toothbrush, and in the evenings with a Sonicare electric toothbrush. I also chew Xylitol gum throughout the day, and have done so for years (ever since my gum surgeries). My periodontist recommended I chew Xylitol gum and use a Sonicare toothbrush, and I think they have helped to improve and maintain my dental health.

my wife is having awful teeth issues . another 10k this year in work after 6k last year and 4k the year before .

she made the mistake of having all her teeth capped 15 years ago . now bacteria is finally working it's way underneath and one by one her teeth are requiring root canals and new caps .

they are doing arestin treatment now . the dentist thought it could save us money if our medicare drug plan would pay for the arestin .

we got a letter back from aetna to say they would cover it . the drug store called to say there would a 1k co-pay on that drug .

we said forget it .

don't misunderstand -- yes, you can buy it with a prescription and typically it is a lot cheaper for the procedure if you buy it and provide it to the dentist if your insurer pays for it . so our dentist gave us the option as she would rather we got it so we could save money on the procedure . it is classified as a tier 3 drug with aetna and is a 1k co-pay . our supplement would pick it up except being pretty healthy she has a high deductible f-plan with a 2k out of pocket .

it really was not worth us buying it since we never come close to the 2k deductible . .

the dentist is providing it way cheaper and with application gets 65 bucks per tooth in nyc which is pretty reasonable here as some dentists get over 100 bucks per tooth .
there are only a few teeth needing it . . it is not being used instead of root canals . this is for the perio issues she has too .

all the other work is so extensive the dentist felt if we could save a few bucks by providing the arestin it would help since other drug plans cover it without a ridiculous co-pay .

but for the drugs we need aetna is great and co-pays are usually like 2 bucks . they just classify this one as way out of bounds evidently .

.