Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

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Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by MediumTex » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:32 am

We all knew the day would come, but it's a sad thing to see.

One of the classic internet discussions I've been a part of.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by l82start » Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:36 pm

any way to get the thread and archive it here for reference and preservation?
Last edited by l82start on Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Roy » Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:47 pm

l82start wrote: anyway to get the thread and archive it here for reference and preservation?
I think that is an excellent idea.

A legendary thread and resource, life-altering in its implications for some.  I found it wonderfully ironic that it was far and away the most popular thread on the Bogleheads board!  It seemed to irk a number of the "true faithful".  And yet, on close inspection, the PP represents so many of those very concepts, just a modified take on diversification.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Maestro G » Wed Oct 20, 2010 1:01 pm

MediumTex wrote: We all knew the day would come, but it's a sad thing to see.

One of the classic internet discussions I've been a part of.
MT,

Agreed, and yes, sad indeed. :(

Roy,

Exactly! "The Majesty of Censorship" ::) Oh well, it's the B/H moderator's sandbox.....

On the positive side, it will make this forum all the more valuable and focused.  8)

Onward!

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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by 6 Iron » Wed Oct 20, 2010 1:53 pm

This is sad news. While Craig's site is much easier to use to investigate the PP, the bogleheads site is much more heavily trafficked, with more divergent opinions. There are members of the bogleheads community that have always been offended by the thread, IMHO, unreasonably so, but I am biased. I would have expected a "last chance" warning and some thread filtering first.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Snowman9000 » Wed Oct 20, 2010 1:55 pm

I just was over there and saw it.  It's too bad.  But it did cover the same ground several times.  Oh well, as others here have said, it was a great discussion.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Lone Wolf » Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:58 pm

Bummer!  I'd like to think that I'd have still found my way to the Permanent Portfolio without the material in that thread.  In all honesty, though, I seriously doubt it.  It got over a million views before they finally turned out the lights!  Incredible.

It makes me a little dizzy to think that my financial future was balanced on the knife's edge of whether I found that thread before they nailed it shut.  In an alternate universe somewhere there's a Bizarro Lone Wolf who never found that thread.  Bizarro Lone Wolf will wind up losing all his money pursuing an investment strategy based around Fibonacci number patterns.

Thanks to all who participated in that thread and in this forum, particularly craigr and MediumTex.  You helped a lot of people who needed it (like me!)
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by MediumTex » Wed Oct 20, 2010 3:16 pm

Lone Wolf wrote: Thanks to all who participated in that thread and in this forum, particularly craigr and MediumTex.  You helped a lot of people who needed it (like me!)
There are so many people in this world who have helped me, it's a privilege to have something useful to offer others.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by craigr » Wed Oct 20, 2010 4:42 pm

It's a shame but was going to happen eventually. This investment strategy is really not what the Diehards advocate. Although both approaches use passive investing and shun market timing, I think the discussion was tolerated but not really welcomed overall.

The reason I started this forum was to have a more focused discussion of the approach without plugging up the Diehards forum with topics and new threads that they probably would rather not have (e.g. Gold, LT bonds and not adjusting allocations based on age). I respect their decision to handle discussions as they think is appropriate for their members.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Pres » Wed Oct 20, 2010 6:13 pm

It was a great thread.

Of course, nothings stops us of starting new threads there that cover subjects related to the permanent portfolio on which Bogleheads can chime in...

For all other needs, I'm very glad Craig created this forum. Where would we be without it?
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by 6 Iron » Wed Oct 20, 2010 7:38 pm

Lone Wolf wrote:   Bizarro Lone Wolf will wind up losing all his money pursuing an investment strategy based around Fibonacci number patterns.
Reading this caused me to launch a small volume of cheap Trader Joe wine out of my nose, but it was worth it.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by smurff » Thu Oct 21, 2010 12:58 am

6 Iron, I'll raise a glass of Three-Buck Chuck to toast that locked thread.  (Two-Buck Chuck costs $2.99 in these parts...)

I found the Diehards' Harry Browne thread before I found this Crawling Road list.  Both have made the transformation of my single portfolio into the PP and VP relatively painless. 

Before this list and that thread, the PP was a theoretical portfolio to me, but one that I had known about for many years.  Spending time on the lists (I'd been lurking for a couple of years before my first post a few days ago) reading what everyone here had to say has helped reduce my reservations about the PP.  I went back to HB's books where he discussed the PP and reread with adult-level wisdom what I had thought merely cool as a teenager back in the 70's and 80's. 

Now that I've implemented it, I feel a sense of calm and peace.  From now  on they can say ANYTHING at CNBC, Zero Hedge, Bloomberg, GEAB, FOFOA,  Gramercy, Jesse's Cafe, etc.; I can now read it and still sleep at night. ;D
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Alex Frakt » Sat Oct 23, 2010 2:10 pm

I returned from a visit to my grandmother's to find the thread had been locked in my absence.  I have always been impressed by the civility of the discussions on the thread and the obvious effort to keep the discussion within the bounds of the bogleheads forum's policies.  However, I do not want to simply restart the original thread for two reasons, first I prefer not to overrule a moderator's actions unless they have clearly misinterpreted forum policies - despite my occasional plea for volunteers, we only have a handful of mods and the forum cannot run without them.  The second reason is a bit more practical: the length of the thread means that it messes up the formatting of the bogleheads.org home page at most screen resolutions.

OTOH, it would be a real shame to see the discussion disappear.  So I am here to personally invite someone, perhaps craigr, to start a new thread on Harry Browne and the permanent portfolio.  Once it is up, I will give a last bump to the old thread to include a link to the new thread (I'll also edit in a link at the beginning).  Once the new thread gets started, please let me know via PM if there are any problems so we can keep the discussion running smoothly.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by MediumTex » Sat Oct 23, 2010 2:39 pm

Alex Frakt wrote: I returned from a visit to my grandmother's to find the thread had been locked in my absence.  I have always been impressed by the civility of the discussions on the thread and the obvious effort to keep the discussion within the bounds of the bogleheads forum's policies.  However, I do not want to simply restart the original thread for two reasons, first I prefer not to overrule a moderator's actions unless they have clearly misinterpreted forum policies - despite my occasional plea for volunteers, we only have a handful of mods and the forum cannot run without them.  The second reason is a bit more practical: the length of the thread means that it messes up the formatting of the bogleheads.org home page at most screen resolutions.

OTOH, it would be a real shame to see the discussion disappear.  So I am here to personally invite someone, perhaps craigr, to start a new thread on Harry Browne and the permanent portfolio.  Once it is up, I will give a last bump to the old thread to include a link to the new thread (I'll also edit in a link at the beginning).  Once the new thread gets started, please let me know via PM if there are any problems so we can keep the discussion running smoothly.
That is some very nice forum cross-pollination there.

Thank you.

It might also be a good idea to place a link to this forum in the final post of the mammoth old BH PP thread.

I view the PP as one of those out of the way ideas in this world that can be of great service to some people.  As such, I like to leave as many bread crumbs for potential PP enthusiasts as I can.

I like very much the idea of having one active PP thread on the BH forum, simply because it is very difficult to keep up with multiple threads treating the same subject, and for someone who just heard about the PP, it would be nice for them to have one thread (or perhaps two if there is an old and new main BH PP thread) to read to become familiar with it (rather than hopping from thread to thread hoping they caught everything of value).

You might even consider making me or craig (if he's interested) "special purpose" mods over at BH and we would be responsible for keeping the PP discussion lean and clean.  I think I posted 800 times or so over at BH, 99% of which were in that one thread.

Just some stuff to think about.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Alex Frakt » Sat Oct 23, 2010 4:36 pm

MediumTex wrote:It might also be a good idea to place a link to this forum in the final post of the mammoth old BH PP thread.
Done - http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... 311#850311.  I'll move the text to the bump post if and when someone starts Harry Browne II at bogleheads.
MediumTex wrote:You might even consider making me or craig (if he's interested) "special purpose" mods over at BH and we would be responsible for keeping the PP discussion lean and clean.  I think I posted 800 times or so over at BH, 99% of which were in that one thread.
It's a good idea, but the version of php we are currently using does not have this option.  We are planning an upgrade in the next month and I'll see what I can work out then.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by MediumTex » Sat Oct 23, 2010 6:18 pm

Alex Frakt wrote:
MediumTex wrote:It might also be a good idea to place a link to this forum in the final post of the mammoth old BH PP thread.
Done - http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... 311#850311.  I'll move the text to the bump post if and when someone starts Harry Browne II at bogleheads.
Thanks.

I started it here:

http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... highlight=
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Pres » Sun Oct 24, 2010 4:12 pm

Alex Frakt wrote: I returned from a visit to my grandmother's to find the thread had been locked in my absence.  I have always been impressed by the civility of the discussions on the thread and the obvious effort to keep the discussion within the bounds of the bogleheads forum's policies. (...) So I am here to personally invite someone, perhaps craigr, to start a new thread on Harry Browne and the permanent portfolio.  Once it is up, I will give a last bump to the old thread to include a link to the new thread (I'll also edit in a link at the beginning).  Once the new thread gets started, please let me know via PM if there are any problems so we can keep the discussion running smoothly.
Thank you! This is a very gracious gesture. :)

I'm happy to see the new thread is doing fine.

P.S. MediumTex, perfect title! Clive, great chart!
Last edited by Pres on Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by craigr » Sun Oct 24, 2010 8:26 pm

Alex Frakt wrote: I returned from a visit to my grandmother's to find the thread had been locked in my absence.  I have always been impressed by the civility of the discussions on the thread and the obvious effort to keep the discussion within the bounds of the bogleheads forum's policies.  However, I do not want to simply restart the original thread for two reasons, first I prefer not to overrule a moderator's actions unless they have clearly misinterpreted forum policies - despite my occasional plea for volunteers, we only have a handful of mods and the forum cannot run without them.  The second reason is a bit more practical: the length of the thread means that it messes up the formatting of the bogleheads.org home page at most screen resolutions.

OTOH, it would be a real shame to see the discussion disappear.  So I am here to personally invite someone, perhaps craigr, to start a new thread on Harry Browne and the permanent portfolio.  Once it is up, I will give a last bump to the old thread to include a link to the new thread (I'll also edit in a link at the beginning).  Once the new thread gets started, please let me know via PM if there are any problems so we can keep the discussion running smoothly.
Alex, thanks for the note and welcome.

I would respectfully request that posters to the Diehards forum not post anything having to do with politics, monetary policy or any other topic that is off limits. The Diehards forum is one of the most popular on the Internet and is largely devoid of market noise. Please respect their posting policies as they are accommodating many users on a broad range of topics and want to keep their discussions focused on their mission. They are a very good group of people there doing a lot of work on a volunteer basis. Please be respectful of their wishes.  
Last edited by craigr on Sun Oct 24, 2010 8:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Lone Wolf » Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:14 am

What a classy way to handle this.  I'm so glad that this information will still be available to Bogleheads.  The Bogleheads discussion was such an enormous help to me that I'd have hated to see it fade completely.  Thanks, Alex!
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Alex Frakt » Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:26 am

I've put up a notification post on the old thread: http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... 171#854171

MediumTex,

Just a suggestion, but you might want to put a quick recap of what the permanent portfolio consists of at the start of the new thread for anyone coming across it for the first time.  There is no time limit on editing your posts.
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by MediumTex » Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:33 pm

Alex Frakt wrote: I've put up a notification post on the old thread: http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... 171#854171

MediumTex,

Just a suggestion, but you might want to put a quick recap of what the permanent portfolio consists of at the start of the new thread for anyone coming across it for the first time.  There is no time limit on editing your posts.
That's a great idea.  I will do that.

Now if we could just track down allenmickers...    :D
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Re: Bogleheads PP Thread Locked

Post by Alex Frakt » Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:50 pm

MediumTex wrote:Now if we could just track down allenmickers...     :D
I'm not sure if you are being serious.  But his bogleheads account is active and he has it set to notify him by e-mail when he receives a PM.  Or you could quote him from the original thread, our copyright policy includes a grant to copy posts within the forum.
Last edited by Alex Frakt on Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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