Optimal Diet

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Kriegsspiel
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed May 05, 2021 4:28 pm

Cortopassi wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 4:03 pm
we don't purposely eat lean cuts of meat, for example, and shoot for good marbling and things like chicken thighs vs. breasts.
Now that I've figured out how to consistently cook breast of chicken to a texture I like*, I prefer it over thighs. Plus, you can add sauces (or whatever) to it. I feel like such a piece of shit that it took me so long to figure this out, but in my defense, my dad loves to grill so I had almost exclusively grilled chicken when I was a kid. *barf*


*(thaw chicken, cut the fat off with scissors, covere with water, medium setting on the Instant Pot for 8.5 hours, then into the fridge overnight)
You there, Ephialtes. May you live forever.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Mark Leavy » Wed May 05, 2021 9:49 pm

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 2:49 pm
His booklet is riddled with nonsense, but that dude lived a wild life.
I love reading all of the old time pioneers. Most of them were nutso, but there was always a gleam of something in there worth picking up.
Around 2005, it was mind bending for me to realize that carbs weren't an essential nutrient. Crazy.

And all of this early exploration was shrouded in mystique, crazy personalities and anecdotes. Great fun reading.

Another great (yet seriously nutso) mind is Ray Peat. That guy is seriously off the rails - yet... I alway wondered what he was seeing that caused him to think differently.

The literature is full of people like this.
Vilhjalmur Stefansson
Wolfgang Lutz
The Drinking Man's Diet
William Banting

They were all early pioneers, screwing up the details but somehow grasping that something was wrong.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by glennds » Thu May 06, 2021 7:06 pm

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 4:28 pm
Now that I've figured out how to consistently cook breast of chicken to a texture I like*, I prefer it over thighs. Plus, you can add sauces (or whatever) to it. I feel like such a piece of shit that it took me so long to figure this out, but in my defense, my dad loves to grill so I had almost exclusively grilled chicken when I was a kid. *barf*


*(thaw chicken, cut the fat off with scissors, covere with water, medium setting on the Instant Pot for 8.5 hours, then into the fridge overnight)
I will try this, but just want to clarify. When you say medium setting for 8.5 hours, you must mean slow cook mode, right? I have done chicken breast in the Instant Pot in pressure cook mode for 8 minutes plus 7 minute release. It works well for shredded chicken breast.
But I'm interested to try it your way if I've understood it properly. Sounds like sous vide.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Kriegsspiel » Thu May 06, 2021 7:09 pm

glennds wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 7:06 pm
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 4:28 pm
Now that I've figured out how to consistently cook breast of chicken to a texture I like*, I prefer it over thighs. Plus, you can add sauces (or whatever) to it. I feel like such a piece of shit that it took me so long to figure this out, but in my defense, my dad loves to grill so I had almost exclusively grilled chicken when I was a kid. *barf*


*(thaw chicken, cut the fat off with scissors, covere with water, medium setting on the Instant Pot for 8.5 hours, then into the fridge overnight)
I will try this, but just want to clarify. When you say medium setting for 8.5 hours, you must mean slow cook mode, right? I have done chicken breast in the Instant Pot in pressure cook mode for 8 minutes plus 7 minute release. It works well for shredded chicken breast.
But I'm interested to try it your way if I've understood it properly. Sounds like sous vide.
Yea, that's on the slow cooker setting. I let it rest for a few minutes after I take it out of the Instant Pot before I tupperware it and put it in the fridge. It has a better texture the next day, IMO.
You there, Ephialtes. May you live forever.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Kriegsspiel » Thu May 06, 2021 7:38 pm

You may be tempted to combine the chicken with salad after refrigeration... while some people DO, I generally DO NOT like the texture of breast in plants.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by glennds » Thu May 06, 2021 7:58 pm

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 7:38 pm
You may be tempted to combine the chicken with salad after refrigeration... while some people DO, I generally DO NOT like the texture of breast in plants.
Thanks for clarifying. I will give it a try, and I have a feeling I will be unable to augment your recipe.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Hal » Thu May 06, 2021 9:05 pm

Mark Leavy wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 9:49 pm
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 2:49 pm
His booklet is riddled with nonsense, but that dude lived a wild life.
I love reading all of the old time pioneers. Most of them were nutso, but there was always a gleam of something in there worth picking up.
Around 2005, it was mind bending for me to realize that carbs weren't an essential nutrient. Crazy.
Funny, on reading your post, remembered this quote about not needing carbs.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Cortopassi » Fri May 07, 2021 8:33 am

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 7:38 pm
I generally DO NOT like the texture of breast in plants.
I'm not sure if that was a play on words, but if it was I finally got it...
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Kriegsspiel » Fri May 07, 2021 9:52 pm

Cortopassi wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 8:33 am
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 7:38 pm
I generally DO NOT like the texture of breast in plants.
I'm not sure if that was a play on words, but if it was I finally got it...
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

I'm not above tossing salad jokes around here.
You there, Ephialtes. May you live forever.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by glennds » Sat May 08, 2021 10:42 am

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 7:09 pm
glennds wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 7:06 pm
Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 4:28 pm
Now that I've figured out how to consistently cook breast of chicken to a texture I like*, I prefer it over thighs. Plus, you can add sauces (or whatever) to it. I feel like such a piece of shit that it took me so long to figure this out, but in my defense, my dad loves to grill so I had almost exclusively grilled chicken when I was a kid. *barf*


*(thaw chicken, cut the fat off with scissors, covere with water, medium setting on the Instant Pot for 8.5 hours, then into the fridge overnight)
I will try this, but just want to clarify. When you say medium setting for 8.5 hours, you must mean slow cook mode, right? I have done chicken breast in the Instant Pot in pressure cook mode for 8 minutes plus 7 minute release. It works well for shredded chicken breast.
But I'm interested to try it your way if I've understood it properly. Sounds like sous vide.
Yea, that's on the slow cooker setting. I let it rest for a few minutes after I take it out of the Instant Pot before I tupperware it and put it in the fridge. It has a better texture the next day, IMO.
Krieg,
I tried this yesterday and IMO the chicken breast is kind of overcooked like this. I like it better pressure cooked in the Instant Pot for 8 minutes plus 7 minutes natural release. Maybe your method would work better using less time than 8.5 hours? I did some research and two other recipes I found call for 3 hours in slow cook mode.
However, your way did result in a beautifully clear, tasty broth. Liquid gold. The kind you find in a good matzo ball soup. So thanks to you, I will now do broth from bones in the long slow cook mode instead of pressure cook. Looking forward to trying it with some beef bones. Thank you!
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by HeidyLin » Sun Mar 19, 2023 11:15 am

Hey there! I know this forum post about optimal human diets is pretty old, but I still wanted to share my thoughts. While there are a lot of popular diets out there, I don't think there's one perfect diet for everyone. We all have different bodies and different nutritional needs, so what works for one person might not work for another. That being said, I personally believe that a diet rich in natural foods is a great starting point. Whole foods like fruits, veggies, whole grains, and lean proteins can provide a wide range of nutrients that our bodies need to thrive. And if you're looking for healthy, natural food options, you might want to check out a natural foods company. They often offer a variety of nutritious options that can make healthy eating easier and more convenient. Good luck on your nutrition journey!
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Kriegsspiel » Sun Mar 19, 2023 11:45 am

Thanks for the thread bump, bot! I got an air fryer recently that I've been using it to cook chicken. It's fantastic. Dredge chicken in flour, throw it in the air fryer, take it out 20 mins later perfectly done. It's a real game changer.

EDIT I also started doing 6.5 hours instead of the 8 I had been doing in the Instant Pot, and it was much better.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Pointedstick » Sun Dec 17, 2023 1:24 pm

I found this thread a while ago and it inspired me to try to lose some weight. I wasn't overweight, but I was heavier than I wanted to be by about 15 pounds. In the past, I'd tried all sorts of diets and exercise regimes and nothing really worked, or I couldn't manage to keep it up. So inspired by the ideas in this thread, I decided to try something new, something nice and simple:

1. Skip breakfast
2. No snacking between meals
3. No sweets anymore

That was it. And the results have been great! Over the past 3 months I've lost 10 pounds and kept it off. #1 basically produces the effect of intermittent fasting, and #2 keeps insulin down to stay in a fat-burning state longer (If I'm understanding and remembering stuff I read earlier in the thread correctly). #3 has been the hard one for me because I really like sweets, and I do cheat a bit. I've noticed that when I don't cheat, I lose weight faster, but when I do, I still lose weight, just not as fast. So do I still let myself have some sweets from time to time.

Other than that, I impose no dietary restrictions; if I'm feeling famished by lunchtime, I eat a giant meal consisting of whatever the hell I want. Often this makes me not feel hungry by dinnertime, and in this case I either skip it or eat a very light dinner. By restricting food to mealtimes, I feel like my body has been sending me much clearer "I'm hungry" and "I'm full" signals now. I do still find myself getting hungry at breakfast time, but it feels easy to ignore since I have a hard-and-fast rule, and since breakfast is only a couple of hours before lunch, I can just look forward to a mouth-wateringly large and tasty lunch. I also don't have to exercise at all. I work from home and have a fairly sedentary lifestyle and am losing weight anyway. I love how easy it feels.

So thanks for the great ideas and discussion, everyone!
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by vnatale » Sun Dec 17, 2023 5:49 pm

Pointedstick wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2023 1:24 pm

I found this thread a while ago and it inspired me to try to lose some weight. I wasn't overweight, but I was heavier than I wanted to be by about 15 pounds. In the past, I'd tried all sorts of diets and exercise regimes and nothing really worked, or I couldn't manage to keep it up. So inspired by the ideas in this thread, I decided to try something new, something nice and simple:

1. Skip breakfast
2. No snacking between meals
3. No sweets anymore

That was it. And the results have been great! Over the past 3 months I've lost 10 pounds and kept it off. #1 basically produces the effect of intermittent fasting, and #2 keeps insulin down to stay in a fat-burning state longer (If I'm understanding and remembering stuff I read earlier in the thread correctly). #3 has been the hard one for me because I really like sweets, and I do cheat a bit. I've noticed that when I don't cheat, I lose weight faster, but when I do, I still lose weight, just not as fast. So do I still let myself have some sweets from time to time.

Other than that, I impose no dietary restrictions; if I'm feeling famished by lunchtime, I eat a giant meal consisting of whatever the hell I want. Often this makes me not feel hungry by dinnertime, and in this case I either skip it or eat a very light dinner. By restricting food to mealtimes, I feel like my body has been sending me much clearer "I'm hungry" and "I'm full" signals now. I do still find myself getting hungry at breakfast time, but it feels easy to ignore since I have a hard-and-fast rule, and since breakfast is only a couple of hours before lunch, I can just look forward to a mouth-wateringly large and tasty lunch. I also don't have to exercise at all. I work from home and have a fairly sedentary lifestyle and am losing weight anyway. I love how easy it feels.

So thanks for the great ideas and discussion, everyone!


I thought I'd learned long ago that the greatest determinant of one's weight is the type of food one chooses to eat and the quantities of food one eats. Exercise is great for the body but it is somewhat minor in weight control compared to the major of food intake.
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Pointedstick » Mon Dec 18, 2023 10:36 am

I think it's fairly obvious that if you want to lose weight, you have to eat less food relative to your energy expenditure. The challenge is doing it, because the body doesn't seem like it really wants you to lose weight! Not an evolutionary advantage for most of the history of homo sapiens, or something.

So you have to basically trick yourself into reducing your food intake. What works is going to differ from person to person because everyone's psychology is unique. What's worked for me is setting these two hard-and-fast rules, and after a month or so, they became a habit and now aren't hard for me to follow at all. I suspect other related things helped as well such as moving into my new home office and spending less time in or near the kitchen or where all the food is located!

On top of that, it seems like intermittent fasting is a biological trick; it tricks your body into being in fat burning mode more often than it otherwise would be if you're just browsing on food all day.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by vnatale » Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:33 am

Pointedstick wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2023 10:36 am

I think it's fairly obvious that if you want to lose weight, you have to eat less food relative to your energy expenditure. The challenge is doing it, because the body doesn't seem like it really wants you to lose weight! Not an evolutionary advantage for most of the history of homo sapiens, or something.

So you have to basically trick yourself into reducing your food intake. What works is going to differ from person to person because everyone's psychology is unique. What's worked for me is setting these two hard-and-fast rules, and after a month or so, they became a habit and now aren't hard for me to follow at all. I suspect other related things helped as well such as moving into my new home office and spending less time in or near the kitchen or where all the food is located!

On top of that, it seems like intermittent fasting is a biological trick; it tricks your body into being in fat burning mode more often than it otherwise would be if you're just browsing on food all day.


It's not necessarily reducing your food intake.

This book well demonstrates that:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/1579542417/?r ... l_huc_item

His book has many, many, many side-by-side pictures like this one where he shows you can eat this much for so many calories or an incredibly more amount of food for the same (or less) calories.

Capture.JPG
Capture.JPG (29.3 KiB) Viewed 24307 times


However just as there are many paths / methods to investing success ... the same applies to weight control.

Congratulations on you finding something that does work for you.
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by boglerdude » Tue Dec 19, 2023 2:22 am

Black coffee or a spoon of peanut butter are good appetite killers
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by vnatale » Tue Dec 19, 2023 7:01 am

boglerdude wrote:
Tue Dec 19, 2023 2:22 am

Black coffee or a spoon of peanut butter are good appetite killers


Agree with the peanut butter. But it takes more than one spoon for me.
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by boglerdude » Tue Dec 19, 2023 8:40 pm

Get on my level Vinny.

Also I slam 6oz black coffee when I wake up, then lay down again for 20min until it hits. Waking up has always been rough.

Setting up a treadmill with a TV. Should be able to walk for hours if I can surf youtube. Seems I need a lot of exercise to sleep well, still trying to figure out if "mental energy" is a thing. Cuz I sleep better if I have some kratom and do a lot of miserable things like paperwork, taxes, scheduling etc.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by vnatale » Wed Dec 20, 2023 8:43 am

boglerdude wrote:
Tue Dec 19, 2023 8:40 pm

Get on my level Vinny.

Also I slam 6oz black coffee when I wake up, then lay down again for 20min until it hits. Waking up has always been rough.

Setting up a treadmill with a TV. Should be able to walk for hours if I can surf youtube. Seems I need a lot of exercise to sleep well, still trying to figure out if "mental energy" is a thing. Cuz I sleep better if I have some kratom and do a lot of miserable things like paperwork, taxes, scheduling etc.


I fall asleep in less than a minute. If I watch my liquid intake and no cat interrupts my sleep I can oftentimes sleep for 6, 7 straight hours.

Never heard of kraton before. This is it?

https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-life ... t-20402171
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Pointedstick » Wed Dec 20, 2023 11:53 am

vnatale wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:33 am
It's not necessarily reducing your food intake.
Yeah, I mean in the end it's just calories in and calories out. But my point is that if having fewer of the former and more of the latter were easy, everyone would be slim. In reality what matters most is finding the techniques and tricks that work for you personally to actually achieve it. For me it's skipping breakfast and snacks (fewer calories in) and intermittent fasting (more calories out), with no changes to level of exercise or diet. But those might work better for someone else.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by vnatale » Wed Dec 20, 2023 1:20 pm

Pointedstick wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2023 11:53 am

vnatale wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:33 am

It's not necessarily reducing your food intake.


Yeah, I mean in the end it's just calories in and calories out. But my point is that if having fewer of the former and more of the latter were easy, everyone would be slim. In reality what matters most is finding the techniques and tricks that work for you personally to actually achieve it. For me it's skipping breakfast and snacks (fewer calories in) and intermittent fasting (more calories out), with no changes to level of exercise or diet. But those might work better for someone else.


Yes. Agree with you.
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats." AND "I'm a more-is-more person."
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by boglerdude » Wed Dec 20, 2023 8:10 pm

"I fall asleep in less than a minute. Never heard of kraton before."

A.I. created to troll me. My Billy Budd. The only thing I want is good sleep. And then cherry picks data to fit a pre-established, comfortable narrative, in this case that kratom is bad.

But he's right, as usual. Its a mild opiate and causes all the problems any drug does. Can give superhuman performance for a few hours but what goes up must come down. Unless backed by the Fed ;)
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by whatchamacallit » Fri Feb 02, 2024 4:04 pm

Thank you for the reminder of intermittent fasting. This has been a game changer for me. Most recently before that I was trying to just eat healthier with low carb but it was unrealistic for my cravings.

I had previously had trouble with intermittent fasting but something was finally able to click in my system to stop the light headed feeling I used to get.

The best thing I can think of, is doing low carb for awhile before trying to fast helped my body adjust.

If anyone is having trouble with intermittent fasting I would recommend starting with low carb for a week at least first. I expect this gets your body used to using fat for energy. If you don't eat carbs for 72 hours your body should be in ketosis so you should get used to burning fat for energy which is what your body would have to do when you are fasting. Low carb was never fun for me but I expect it should be easy enough for a week.

Next try just skipping breakfast and eating carbs again if you desire to for a week or so and the jump to one meal a day becomes easier as you learn to embrace the hungry feeling.

Once you get down to one meal a day, then the jump to an even longer fast becomes easier.

If you are in the habit of eating only one meal a day then it is now easier to skip that one meal until the next day.

I was able to do an 8 day fast which I never would have thought possible. I then went down the rabbit hole of the benefits of fasting and healing your cells. I didn't know how long I would fast going into it. I thought I might try for 21 at the most but started to get muscle cramps after 7 so I figured it wasn't beneficial for me at that point.

It is now so easy to eat only one meal a day but I haven't tried fasting for longer again yet. I have been pretty much eating whatever I want limited to a 3 hour or so period of the day. Some days I eat more than others but have not really been paying attention to calories. So far the weight has stayed off and I feel more energetic than I have in a long time.
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Re: Optimal Diet

Post by Smith1776 » Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:54 pm

As someone who has been quite into fitness until the past couple years (life has gotten in the way), I have to agree with the sentiment that calorie restriction is really the big ticket item that makes the difference. I don't even mean just losing weight, but also for longevity in addition to having more energy and fewer "glitches" in the body.

It's kind of strange that consuming fewer calories (energy) actually gives one more energy. The irony is palpable, but that's the way it goes it seems.

I also find that psychologically, having fewer calories gives one greater focus. There's something about having a full stomach that really robs one of sense of urgency regarding goals and deadlines.

Lots of water and protein rich foods makes calorie restriction fairly easy.
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