Coronavirus General Discussion

[jalanlong]

corona virus prediction....

within the next year to three years our response to this virus will be widely viewed as a global episode of mass hysteria...

there will be some who deeply committed to the panic, who will never accept that reality, but as time passes our current madness will largely become recognized for what it is...

So in order for that to happen, someone will have to backtrack and claim they made a mistake. Who will do that: health experts, media or politicians? And keep in mind that them admitting that to the public could make it more difficult to implement authoritarian measures in future "emergencies" so it is not in their best interest to ever admit it was an overreaction, much less hysteria.

that is a interesting point, there may be more vested interest in the hysteria than i think...
i hope not.. but its possible...

[yankees60]

corona virus prediction....

within the next year to three years our response to this virus will be widely viewed as a global episode of mass hysteria...

there will be some who deeply committed to the panic, who will never accept that reality, but as time passes our current madness will largely become recognized for what it is...

What is your evaluation to our country's response to the events of a few hours on 9/11/01?

Less than 4,000 American deaths that day yet directly led to untold deaths of citizens of Iraq. Many, many, many deaths and casualties among our military. Trillions of $$$$$$ spent on war making. A lot of restrictions on our ways of life that still persist to this day over 19 years later.

I suspect that 100 years from now history may well judge far more harshly that response than this virus response.

I already judge it pretty harshly... more harshly may be justified ...

[dualstow]

I don't necessarily disagree with you, Simon. It's just that you called it a reality whereas I would call it a potential reality.

...
as a global episode of mass hysteria...
there will be some who deeply committed to the panic, who will never accept that reality,
...

We've all seen pictures of past plagues and the same masks and resistance to those masks. Perhaps the next plague will also feature both attitudes.

I can't remember if I already mentioned it. At an ice cream place near my folks -- I have been there -- two employees were put in the hospital after they asked two patrons to put on masks while in the shop. One with broken bones. To me that's an overreaction.

"understanding of reality" would have been a clearer way for me to have said it..

big over reaction.. lots on both sides.. the media, the hype, the lock-downs, the micromanagement of peoples lives by busybody governors with aspirations of dictatorship, the overreaction to the overreaction... a lot of mass hysteria all the way round

[Kriegsspiel]

I can't remember if I already mentioned it. At an ice cream place near my folks -- I have been there -- two employees were put in the hospital after they asked two patrons to put on masks while in the shop. One with broken bones. To me that's an overreaction.

Yea but... what did they say AFTER they asked them to put on masks? It could have been a

"Hey sirs, please put on masks."
"Sure thing champ."
"By the way the Flyers blow ass."
"&#$% YOU!"
*fisticuffs*

[dualstow]

That's how it went down. Except it would have been the Baltimore...Clippers?

[Kriegsspiel]

I believe Baltimore has a football team, but I doubt anyone would be as attached to it as Philly people are to their teams.

[Kriegsspiel]

Since most of what I know about Baltimore comes from The Wire, I'd also suggest that they could have scuffled over heroin and/or burner phones.

[Tortoise]

Since most of what I know about Baltimore comes from The Wire, I'd also suggest that they could have scuffled over heroin and/or burner phones.

[Tortoise]

Well, it looks like Newsom has now mandated a month-long curfew in CA, but the Sacramento County Sheriff's Office (Newsom's own county) told him to take his unconstitutional overreach and shove it:

In response to much social uncertainty and numerous inquiries, I wanted to clarify the position of the Sacramento Sheriff’s Office relative to existing health orders, as well as any potential impending orders at the County or State level.

The Sacramento County Sheriff’s Office will not be determining—including entering any home or business—compliance with, or enforcing compliance of, any health or emergency orders related to curfews, staying at home, Thanksgiving or other social gatherings inside or outside the home, maximum occupancy, or mask mandates. Further, we will not dispatch officers for these purposes—callers will be advised to call 3-1-1 and be routed to County Health. Of course, if there is potential criminal behavior or the potential for impacts to public or personal safety we will continue to respond appropriately.

I would like to wish everyone a happy and meaningful Thanksgiving Holiday.

-Sheriff Scott Jones

Newsom seems to finally be losing popularity here in the Golden State. It's about time.

finally.. hope it spreads...

the loss of popularity that is..

[Maddy]

It's being reported this morning that Germany has once again gone full-blown Nazi, carrying out raids against citizens daring to contradict the official CoVid narrative.

https://twitter.com/JohnBWellsCTM/statu ... 7384527874

Still think this is about a virus?

[flyingpylon]

This is a very interesting interview with Mike Yeadon, a former VP at Pfizer, regarding his thoughts about COVID-19 and the UK’s response to it. It has been removed by YouTube but it’s still available at Facebook... for now.

https://www.facebook.com/unlockedunited ... 283542470/

[Hal]

It's being reported this morning that Germany has once again gone full-blown Nazi, carrying out raids against citizens daring to contradict the official CoVid narrative.

https://twitter.com/JohnBWellsCTM/statu ... 7384527874

Still think this is about a virus?

Well, it does seem an over reaction to get intelligence agencies involved...
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/gov ... own-report

[Libertarian666]

The media hasn't allowed even a small slice of the truth about this to be aired. I am, at the moment, beginning the workup of a wrongful death case involving one of the many victims of this political stunt who were locked down and therefore unable to obtain monitoring and treatment for cancer. It was my friend, and I watched the whole fricking thing unfold from beginning to end.

They've counted every last sniffle in this county, but no one has shown the slightest interest in including my friend's death in their statistics.

How awful. The people responsible for this outrage should roast in hell.

[Tortoise]

A recent medical study found that of people who test positive for SARS-CoV-2 on an RT-PCR test with a cycle threshold of 35 (the standard threshold currently used in the U.S.), less than 3% of them are actually infectious:

https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-ar ... 91/5912603

The take-home message: For many months now, U.S. policy decisions on lockdowns, school closures, etc. have been based on an RT-PCR test setting that’s far too sensitive for the intended application.

[Libertarian666]

A recent medical study found that of people who test positive for SARS-CoV-2 on an RT-PCR test with a cycle threshold of 35 (the standard threshold currently used in the U.S.), less than 3% of them are actually infectious:

https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-ar ... 91/5912603

The take-home message: For many months now, U.S. policy decisions on lockdowns, school closures, etc. have been based on an RT-PCR test setting that’s far too sensitive for the intended application.

Depending on the definition of "intended", of course.

[Cortopassi]

I have not approached my friends here at work who were of the belief that on Nov 4th, Corona would just start "disappearing."

Wondering for those who track Q or other conspiracies, what the latest conspiracy morphing has become?

Has it gone from Covid disappearing after the election to Biden's going to lock everybody down for months and destroy the economy?

I suppose most in the conspiracy crowd still believe Trump will stay in office?

I thought I was writing this tongue in cheek, but I am seriously asking.

[Cortopassi]

Corto, is this a conspiracy?

Why Is Big Media Hiding That Illinois Has Far More COVID Cases Than Florida? Because Illinois Has A Democrat In Charge And Tighter Lockdowns

Biased? Absolutely. Grand conspiracy? Unlikely.

And if the intention was to single out FL so more people would vote for Biden, it didn't work.

[WiseOne]

Is that even really worth talking about? It all depends on how much testing is done - which depends in part on how panicky the population is. Remember that when the media says "cases" they really mean "positive tests", which are an entirely different animal and some unknown proportion of them are clinically irrelevant. And "hospitalizations are increasing" is not helpful either, because that always happens this time of year. You need to know whether the increase differs from the normal range.

Perhaps a better assessment is the question I asked a couple people I know on the front lines: If there was no media reporting, no testing, and you weren't aware that there was such a thing as COVID, would current conditions in emergency medical settings be unusual?

My sister (ER doc in Massachusetts) said yes, because of nursing home patients coming in with clinical syndromes that are not like the flu. The number of these isn't too different from what she'd normally see, only the clinical presentation. And she's not seeing anything unusual in any other demographic group.

My friend (NYC paramedic) said no. He's been watching the figures for ambulance/911 calls, and there is nothing out of the ordinary going on. In the spring he was working extra shifts nonstop for the two months that the big spike lasted, but none of that is happening now. Wonder what they're going to do with that new field hospital in Staten Island...probably same as the one in Javits in the spring, i.e. a bunch of photo ops for the governor.

[I Shrugged]

A lot of times, what looks like a conspiracy or coordinated action is just common goals.

[Tortoise]

Pardon the weird format (lack of capitalization, etc.); I copied this verbatim from Twitter. Source link provided at the bottom of this post.

@foogatwo was kind enough to introduce me to a fun new CDC tool that tracks CARES act funding by hospital

one need not possess sherlock holmesian deductive powers to guess that those under the cuomo regime would be first & piggiest about getting snouts in trough

5/5 top spots!



big props to NYC HHC for getting twice as much as the next closest competitor!

$1.2 bn in federal funding. to one hospital system.

NY presby in second with 630 million. montfiore in 3rd with 467mm.

a full NYstate podium!

these are the true champions of crony capitalism.

NYS got 12% of funding. (5.7% of US population)

the only hospital outside of NY state to break $400mm in funding was HMH and they are actually 1/2 in NY 1/2 in NJ, so they get some honorary rights

once you break the top 10, it's <$300 million a paltry 25% of NYC HHC

pikers...

the average US hospital received $251,036, 0.02% of NYC HHC.

they got 4730X as much.

median was $9,994.

NYC HHC got $1,196,544,217. that's 120,000X the median.

boy, knowing how to play the pork game sure does pay.

bigly.

(pigly?)

$98 billion has been allocated via this program.

391,602 hospitals have been recipients.

the top 10% have taken $92 billion of that. (94%)

the top 1% have taken $71 billion (72%)

the top 0.1% have taken $35 billion (36%)

392 hospitals out of 391,602 got 36% of funds.



so, the next time you wonder: "why would hospitals seek to overstate covid" keep this in mind.

this is why. it's been a massive pork barrel bonanza if you know how to play the game of "find covid, get paid from federal firehose of funding."



this has been a never before seen grab bag of goodies and danger for the US hospital system.

they were forbidden from undertaking the elective procedures that pay all the bills and left reeling and insolvent.

then they were offered gobs of free money for finding covid.

what else could they do? this was clearly a gravy train leaving the station and their core businesses had been demolished by governmental diktat.

so they responded to incentives to survive.

it's not some conspiracy, it's just bad incentives breeding bad behavior.

and until we shut off this staggering spigot of funding, it is not going to stop.

big business LOVES crony capitalism. it's safer, more predictable, and harder for competitors to encroach on.

it's also terrible for consumers, taxpayers, and in cases like this all citizens.

the over reporting and over-diagnosis this encourages is then used to inform policy that further limits hospitals' traditional revenue lines and adds more pork.

competing for that pork ups apparent dangers through over-reporting.

this tightens policy.

it's inescapable so long as the money flows and it rewards the worst and most aggressively cronyistic and at the expense of the honest and non-politically connected.

it is everything you do not want in a hospital system and a government.

stop the gravy.

#DemandBetter

the tool can be found here:

feel free to check my work.

https://t.co/9isThLGpMm?amp=1

https://twitter.com/boriquagato/status/ ... 9260419073

[Kriegsspiel]

Johns Hopkins study confirms what WiseOne has been saying for a while.

The study found that “This trend is completely contrary to the pattern observed in all previous years.” In fact, “the total decrease in deaths by other causes almost exactly equals the increase in deaths by COVID-19.”

Briand concludes that the COVID-19 death toll in the United States is misleading and that deaths from other diseases are being categorized as COVID-19 deaths.

'"On Thursday, Johns Hopkins University explained that they deleted the article on the study because it “was being used to support false and dangerous inaccuracies about the impact of the pandemic.”' Narrative collapse.

[dualstow]

If covid took away my sense of taste and smell, I would want to die.

[Kriegsspiel]

Hedonic Helen Kellers Longing For Death: Americans And The Coronavirus.

[Libertarian666]

If covid took away my sense of taste and smell, I would want to die.

It's temporary, at least from what I've seen.

[Cortopassi]

If covid took away my sense of taste and smell, I would want to die.

Of the 6 people in my office who have gotten it, 3 had lost their sense of taste and smell. Mostly back for all of them, but went through a period of things tasting wrong too.

I had some sort of sinus issue 30 years ago and lost sense of smell for around a year. It sucked.