Coronavirus General Discussion

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Cortopassi
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Cortopassi » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:01 am

Chris Christie statement after his time in the ICU:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/15/politics ... index.html

Most important part, for me, my highlight:

I have also concluded that like much else in 2020, that the virus is governed by our two dominant
political and media extremes: those who believe there is nothing to this virus and those
alarmists who would continue to close down our country and not trust the common sense
of the American people. Both are wrong. This is not an either/or proposition. The public
health consequences of ignoring the virus and the responsible safeguards that we need to
take will be additional illness and death caused by COVID-19. The public policy
consequences of continuing to shut down or re-shut down our country will be further
economic devastation to families, even more loss of education by our students and the
continuing loss of life through the drug abuse, suicide and depression caused by taking
away people’s ability to support their families. There is another way.
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I Shrugged
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by I Shrugged » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:59 am

flyingpylon wrote:
Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:40 am
As Gov Cuomo and his extensive PR team attempt to “reimagine” his response to COVID-19, here’s a Twitter thread to remind everyone what an epic fail it really was.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1316 ... 96448.html
I went down this road with a friend who blames Trump for the early days of bad information. What see the Woodward book. So how does the March timeline of Cuomo's statements compare with information that was known or suspected by DC, and when was said info communicated to the states?

ie Did Cuomo know the situation yet, in early and mid March?
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Tortoise
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Tortoise » Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:34 pm

Cortopassi wrote:
Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:01 am
Chris Christie statement after his time in the ICU:
[...]
Christie goes on in his statement to describe his recommended approach (boldface mine):
Every public official, regardless of party or position, should advocate for every American to wear a mask in public, appropriately socially distance and to wash your hands frequently every day. At the same time, we should be reopening in every corner of this nation under these guidelines. Reopen all those places which have taken the brunt of these shutdowns and allow our country to get back to a life where citizens can support their families using common sense. Even during a contentious election year, we must trust the American people with the truth. I believe that these two steps can bring our country together while our pharmaceutical companies invent the therapeutics and vaccines which will rid us of this virus.
The problem with recommending that all Americans socially distance is that it's not viable long-term for many businesses like restaurants, movie theaters, and performance venues. If those businesses are allowed to operate only at 25-50% capacity to meet social distancing requirements, they will bleed red ink until they eventually go out of business. Many of them already have, even though they've "reopened". Christie doesn't acknowledge that in his letter.

Christie missed a good opportunity to point out that Covid-1984 doesn't pose the same risk to all Americans. It poses near-zero risk to most of the population and a much higher risk to the morbidly obese like Christie and to the very old.

It's really sad that "Let businesses reopen at full capacity while protecting the very old and the morbidly obese" is widely seen as an extreme position for some reason.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by doodle » Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:43 pm

Tortoise wrote:
Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:34 pm
Cortopassi wrote:
Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:01 am
Chris Christie statement after his time in the ICU:
[...]
Christie goes on in his statement to describe his recommended approach (boldface mine):
Every public official, regardless of party or position, should advocate for every American to wear a mask in public, appropriately socially distance and to wash your hands frequently every day. At the same time, we should be reopening in every corner of this nation under these guidelines. Reopen all those places which have taken the brunt of these shutdowns and allow our country to get back to a life where citizens can support their families using common sense. Even during a contentious election year, we must trust the American people with the truth. I believe that these two steps can bring our country together while our pharmaceutical companies invent the therapeutics and vaccines which will rid us of this virus.
The problem with recommending that all Americans socially distance is that it's not viable long-term for many businesses like restaurants, movie theaters, and performance venues. If those businesses are allowed to operate only at 25-50% capacity to meet social distancing requirements, they will bleed red ink until they eventually go out of business. Many of them already have, even though they've "reopened". Christie doesn't acknowledge that in his letter.

Christie missed a good opportunity to point out that Covid-1984 doesn't pose the same risk to all Americans. It poses near-zero risk to most of the population and a much higher risk to the morbidly obese like Christie and to the very old.

It's really sad that "Let businesses reopen at full capacity while protecting the very old and the morbidly obese" is widely seen as an extreme position for some reason.
I think that is probably the most rational position at this time....at least it is worth a try...there will be casualties for sure. Children and young people will get sick and die. This will complicate the situation..but as has been mentioned before kids die in car accidents too and we don't stop driving... I think that if our politicians behaved like adults and we had a leader who was better at communicating in the white house that might actually be very possible. Unfortunately none of those are true...humans suck.
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I Shrugged
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by I Shrugged » Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:48 pm

The death rate doesn't seem to be much worse than a bad flu though.
ALTHOUGH, if the PCR tests are indeed putting out a lot of positives that are functional false, then that would make the death rate look lower.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by doodle » Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:30 am

New Zealand yesterday. No masks or social distancing required.
rmafmk9d2gs51.png
rmafmk9d2gs51.png (708.02 KiB) Viewed 137 times


That could be because their nation seems to be largely free from this breed of animal that dominates the American landscape

https://youtu.be/5ukzFwBPwd4
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Mark Leavy
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Mark Leavy » Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:35 am

doodle wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:30 am
New Zealand yesterday. No masks or social distancing required.
That could be because their nation seems to be largely free from this breed of animal that dominates the American landscape
Or because they have the most fierce border closure on the planet.
The New Zealand border is currently closed to almost all travellers to help stop the spread of COVID-19.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by doodle » Sat Oct 17, 2020 9:40 am

The fact is that they are attending crowded sporting events without masks while our numbers are continuing to increase in what is now being called a third wave while we lose nearly 1000 lives a day. The prime minister uses american education as a punchline and people laugh.

Donald Trump failed to lead this nation through this pandemic. Anyone in the business world doing this job as poorly as he did would have been fired.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by pp4me » Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:42 am

doodle wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 9:40 am
Donald Trump failed to lead this nation through this pandemic.
If you don't give any specifics that sounds like nothing more than the Democrat talking point we keep hearing over and over. It works because there is nothing to challenge. If you say he did X when he should have done Y then that can either be debated or else we can agree with you.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:32 pm

doodle wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:30 am
New Zealand yesterday. No masks or social distancing required.

rmafmk9d2gs51.png



That could be because their nation seems to be largely free from this breed of animal that dominates the American landscape

https://youtu.be/5ukzFwBPwd4
There were some fans in the stands at last night's Dodgers / Braves game.

This picture is from the first game of their series.
Capture.JPG
Capture.JPG (174.96 KiB) Viewed 99 times
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sophie
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by sophie » Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:09 pm

Has anyone considered the possibility that *nothing* that any governing body has done has either promoted or prevented the spread of the virus?

In other words, the spread of the virus is not anyone's fault. It's not Trump's fault, it's not Cuomo's fault, and so on. It's about the biology of epidemics. Trying to negate that biology is sort of like the kid who tries to empty the ocean into a sand pit on the beach using a little plastic bucket.

I remember that during the height of the AIDS epidemic, people who blamed the victims for their promiscuous/risky behavior, or said it was a judgment from God, were roundly condemned. I wish we had a bit of that sentiment today.
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I Shrugged
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by I Shrugged » Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:26 pm

sophie wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:09 pm
Has anyone considered the possibility that *nothing* that any governing body has done has either promoted or prevented the spread of the virus?

In other words, the spread of the virus is not anyone's fault....

I have. That’s how it looks to me.
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