Coronavirus General Discussion

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pugchief
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by pugchief » Sun Sep 13, 2020 4:59 pm

technovelist wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:35 am
jalanlong wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:37 am
This is why I am not looking forward to winter...they are going to try to keep it going as long as possible:

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/p ... s-needs-to
The blue state governors will give up on that as soon as the election is over.
Do you believe that statement to be true regardless of who wins the presidential election?
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dualstow
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by dualstow » Sun Sep 13, 2020 5:21 pm

I Shrugged wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:06 am
This thread has sure had a long run. Can you folks maybe take the presidential election stuff to one of the other threads more closely aligned to that?
:)
Bump. Just in case anyone missed IS’s post a couple pages back.
RIP Ron Cobb (Daily Check-in Thread).
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sophie
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by sophie » Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:21 pm

I Shrugged wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 6:23 pm
I would love to see a good healthy debate between someone on the side of Fauci and the Irish guy in the video posted by Shekels.
That would be most interesting!

Both would have to be knowledgeable enough to pick apart published journal articles though. They are filled with logic pitfalls, and in way too many cases, the authors mangle data in order to tell the story they set out to prove. Pretty sure the Irish guy (Ivor Cummins) is aware of this, not sure Fauci is.

Here's another blog you might want to look up: Malcolm Kendrick, a British G.P. who has made something of a career out of debunking the medical literature. He has several interesting articles on COVID. https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/

As far as how long lockdowns might go on....it's becoming clear to me that a vaccine will not be the holy grail everyone thinks it is. I'm pretty sure it'll be another year or maybe two before the last vestiges of lockdown are gone. Compared to that prospect, ripping off the bandaid and letting COVID do its thing, while keeping the (mostly non-working) vulnerable population as protected as possible, seems like the best way to go.
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vnatale
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:31 pm

sophie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:21 pm
I Shrugged wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 6:23 pm
I would love to see a good healthy debate between someone on the side of Fauci and the Irish guy in the video posted by Shekels.
That would be most interesting!

Both would have to be knowledgeable enough to pick apart published journal articles though. They are filled with logic pitfalls, and in way too many cases, the authors mangle data in order to tell the story they set out to prove. Pretty sure the Irish guy (Ivor Cummins) is aware of this, not sure Fauci is.

Here's another blog you might want to look up: Malcolm Kendrick, a British G.P. who has made something of a career out of debunking the medical literature. He has several interesting articles on COVID. https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/

As far as how long lockdowns might go on....it's becoming clear to me that a vaccine will not be the holy grail everyone thinks it is. I'm pretty sure it'll be another year or maybe two before the last vestiges of lockdown are gone. Compared to that prospect, ripping off the bandaid and letting COVID do its thing, while keeping the (mostly non-working) vulnerable population as protected as possible, seems like the best way to go.
Thanks for this. Just read it. To my numbers but non-medical mind it all seemed quite logical and reasonable.

Vinny
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Kriegsspiel
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Kriegsspiel » Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:39 pm

sophie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:21 pm
I'm pretty sure it'll be another year or maybe two before the last vestiges of lockdown are gone. Compared to that prospect, ripping off the bandaid and letting COVID do its thing, while keeping the (mostly non-working) vulnerable population as protected as possible, seems like the best way to go.
Yes.
I hated all the things I had toiled for under the sun, because I must leave them to the one who comes after me. Who knows whether that person will be wise or foolish? Yet they will have control over all the fruit of my toil into which I have poured my effort and skill under the sun. . . Nothing is better for a man than to eat and drink and enjoy his work.
- Ecclesiastes
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by technovelist » Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:06 pm

pugchief wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 4:59 pm
technovelist wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:35 am
jalanlong wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:37 am
This is why I am not looking forward to winter...they are going to try to keep it going as long as possible:

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/p ... s-needs-to
The blue state governors will give up on that as soon as the election is over.
Do you believe that statement to be true regardless of who wins the presidential election?
Yes, I believe it is true either way. They are doing it to hurt Trump's re-election campaign, so either way the election goes there's no point in continuing it after that.

Of course I could be wrong; maybe they are just tyrants who enjoy tormenting their citizens. That's an even more cynical position than I'm willing to take at this point.
Another nod to the most beautiful equation: e + 1 = 0
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by pp4me » Mon Sep 14, 2020 12:58 pm

Masks are still mandatory in my county at least through September, but I was encouraged recently to see that Publix has eliminated the one-way aisles. They still have them at Walmart.

Have to wonder what the science and/or logic was behind this requirement. The only thing I can think of is that two-way traffic would almost guarantee violation of the 6-foot social distancing rule if people passed in opposite directions. I didn't see any "no passing signs" to go along with the one-way signs however so people ended up passing each other any way unless you were willing to wait for the slow person in front of you to move on.

We'll never know, of course, but my guess is that this didn't prevent one transmission of COVID from one person to another.
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Tortoise
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Tortoise » Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:09 pm

Agreed, the "one-way aisle" concept was very poorly conceived and would have made sense only with a corresponding "no passing" rule. I've always ignored the one-way aisle stickers on the ground and have never gotten a single dirty look because of it. Everyone else ignores the stickers, too.

One thing that really irks me is how a lot of the stores who put up big plastic barriers between the customers and cashiers thought it would be a good idea to put big explanatory stickers or signs at the top of the barriers, directly at eye level -- the one part of the barrier that should not be visually obstructed. Because of those damn stickers/signs, I usually have to step to the side of the barrier to make eye contact with the cashier, which defeats the whole purpose of the barrier.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Tortoise » Mon Sep 14, 2020 2:18 pm

Federal judge rules PA Gov. Tom Wolf's shutdown orders were unconstitutional:
https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2020/09 ... itutional/

San Diego County Supervisor plans to ask for businesses to reopen and ignore "impossible" CA state reopening guidelines:
https://twitter.com/jim_desmond/status/ ... 78368?s=20

Image
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Kriegsspiel
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Kriegsspiel » Mon Sep 14, 2020 7:59 pm

Took long enough, but this is great news.
I hated all the things I had toiled for under the sun, because I must leave them to the one who comes after me. Who knows whether that person will be wise or foolish? Yet they will have control over all the fruit of my toil into which I have poured my effort and skill under the sun. . . Nothing is better for a man than to eat and drink and enjoy his work.
- Ecclesiastes
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Cortopassi » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:45 pm

This in an article from the NYT! I feel some change happening!
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Even as Cases Rise, Europe Is Learning to Live With the Coronavirus

In the early days of the pandemic, President Emmanuel Macron exhorted the French to wage “war” against the coronavirus. Today, his message is to “learn how to live with the virus.”

“We are in a living-with-the-virus phase,” said Roberto Speranza, the health minister of Italy, the first country in Europe to impose a national lockdown. In an interview with La Stampa newspaper, Mr. Speranza said that though a “zero infection rate does not exist,” Italy was now far better equipped to handle a surge in infections. “There is not going to be another lockdown,” Mr. Speranza said.

Hendrik Streeck, head of virology at a research hospital in the German city of Bonn, cautioned that the pandemic should not be judged merely by infection numbers, but instead by deaths and hospitalizations. “We’ve have reached a phase where the number of infections alone is no longer as meaningful,” Mr. Streeck said.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by jalanlong » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:10 am

Cortopassi wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:45 pm
This in an article from the NYT! I feel some change happening!
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Even as Cases Rise, Europe Is Learning to Live With the Coronavirus

In the early days of the pandemic, President Emmanuel Macron exhorted the French to wage “war” against the coronavirus. Today, his message is to “learn how to live with the virus.”

“We are in a living-with-the-virus phase,” said Roberto Speranza, the health minister of Italy, the first country in Europe to impose a national lockdown. In an interview with La Stampa newspaper, Mr. Speranza said that though a “zero infection rate does not exist,” Italy was now far better equipped to handle a surge in infections. “There is not going to be another lockdown,” Mr. Speranza said.

Hendrik Streeck, head of virology at a research hospital in the German city of Bonn, cautioned that the pandemic should not be judged merely by infection numbers, but instead by deaths and hospitalizations. “We’ve have reached a phase where the number of infections alone is no longer as meaningful,” Mr. Streeck said.
Great! Now if someone could tell the woman out for a walk down my street this morning wearing a mask, face shield and rubber gloves up to her elbows!
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