Coronavirus General Discussion

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jalanlong
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by jalanlong » Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:09 pm

pp4me
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by pp4me » Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:14 pm

I watched a Youtube on the Spanish Flu yesterday and was surprised to learn that there was a face mask mandate. Not only could you go to jail but a couple of people were even shot and killed according to the video.

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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by dualstow » Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:59 pm

Sounds fair to me.
Herman Cain says the virus is under control and there’s nothing to be concerned about
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:15 pm

pp4me wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:14 pm
I watched a Youtube on the Spanish Flu yesterday and was surprised to learn that there was a face mask mandate. Not only could you go to jail but a couple of people were even shot and killed according to the video.

Image
Last week I read a book on the Spanish Flu. In it were several pages on the mask debate, similar to now. I was going to put pictures of those pages here but sufficient motivation to do so never appeared.

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by pp4me » Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:32 pm

vnatale wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:15 pm
pp4me wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:14 pm
I watched a Youtube on the Spanish Flu yesterday and was surprised to learn that there was a face mask mandate. Not only could you go to jail but a couple of people were even shot and killed according to the video.

Image
Last week I read a book on the Spanish Flu. In it were several pages on the mask debate, similar to now. I was going to put pictures of those pages here but sufficient motivation to do so never appeared.

Vinny
The Youtube I watched was produced by a mask advocate but after reading further about it the experiment apparently didn't do much to settle the debate. Some people even claim it might have done more harm than good or at least did no good at all.
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vnatale
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:57 am

A caller to C-Span's Washington Journal this morning was a doctor. He recommended these as two authoritative sources.

I don't normally watch videos or listen to podcasts. I do plan to listen to all of these (and, probably, each one of the series twice)

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/t ... 1504360345

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeXITBl6W8Q

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by sophie » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:10 am

Remember when we were talking about school reopenings, and I said if they didn’t reopen parents would take matters into their own hands?

Well looks like that’s indeed happening. Would it be awesome if some find they prefer small independent schools? This could change the way we do education in this country permanently.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/schoolhous ... yURL_share
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by Cortopassi » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:45 am

sophie wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:10 am
Remember when we were talking about school reopenings, and I said if they didn’t reopen parents would take matters into their own hands?

Well looks like that’s indeed happening. Would it be awesome if some find they prefer small independent schools? This could change the way we do education in this country permanently.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/schoolhous ... yURL_share
We will have a "pod" of three girls in my basement who are all on the same class track in high school learning together and helping each other if we go remote. At least to get some human interaction vs. staring at a screen.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:05 am

While I was moving around the house getting things done I listened to this on my wireless headphones and it is outstanding!

Together During Covid19: Dr. David Katz

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeXITBl6W8Q

The doctor was asked ALL the questions and he directly answers ALL of them.

As soon as I finally take my morning shower I'm headed outside to organize a lot of papers. But while doing so I'm am AGAIN going to listen to this entire thing. And, I'll have my iPad with me so I can take some notes, which I will then pass on here.

If Sophie listens to this I'd be extremely interested in her reaction as his approach seems quite similar to what it seems to what she preaches to us here. Essentially, taking a risk based approach.

Finally, it's his impression that 50% of the population is resistant to the virus and it only affects 20% of the population. Again, HIS impression. Not yet scientifically based.

Vinny
"I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:04 pm

Just finished listening for the second time. Below are my notes.

Vinny

Dr. Katz


Desperately sick in hospital primarily there for three reasons: tobacco, lack of physical exercise, poor diet. Responsible for 80% of premature deaths. Far and away diet is the most. Every year, aside from the virus, kills 500,000 people.


Main good diet based around real food -- identifiable from nature, plant based, plain water. About 15 types of diets can include this.


What you do is based upon who you are with and what is going around viral circulation-wise. He hugged his mom for the first time.


Basic precautions go far tempered by the relative risk around you. If low risk you can relax some of the precautions.


Any infectious disease depends upon the dose and your degree of defense.


There has not been one documented case of anyone getting the virus from a surface. Quite low risk.


Your exposure to viral load is determinant. Singing greatly spreads. Talking outside in the sunlight is much safer.


Going to a supermarket should not be dangerous because of what they and you are doing. Everyone wearing a mask. No risk from someone touching food.


Eating at restaurants depends where you are in the country. Would need to take more precautions in Arizona.


Barbershops safe with proper precautions.


Would eat food prepared in a restaurant.


Feel as safe in other stores as in a supermarket.


He makes a distinction between protests and annual event gatherings. The latter can be postponed while the former is not a scheduled event.


You protest when you passions are inflamed. One had more discretion on timing than the other.


Seemed like the protests in the Northeast did not lead to spreading.


His impression is that 50 to 80% of the people have native resistance while only 20 to 50% get it. And with the 20% we may have achieved herd immunity.


That may explain why the Northeast protests did not lead to outbreaks.


True health initiative


You want to look both ways. It's bad to get the virus. It's also bad to lose your job. Need to do risk based interdiction. If you are under 50 and in good health you have little too worry about. But don't be a spreader to those at risk.


Shutdowns were done haphazardly. Schools should not have shut down. A lot else should not have been shut down.


Should be reopened in a risk stratified manner,


It's soon to open up and if you are a vulnerable person and feel okay.


He looks at big picture while he is a scientist involved with the virus he also worries about jobs.


No one has an idea when there could be a vaccine. Maybe never.


When he was volunteering in new York city he was seeing more effective treatments every day. Treatment protocols were radically different from the week before.


The percentage of people who survive is going up every week. Successful treatment knowledge being constantly shared from around the world.


If only a few hundred in a state of several million of means your risk is like winning the lottery. Slim. Situational awareness.


In the Northeast he feels fine with his elderly parents coming back to normal life.


Does not see a second wave because of so much native resistance and those already exposed.


Seeing a delayed first wave in some parts of the country due to premature lockdown.


Need to lead with healthy young people getting out there.


Don't fear for a second wave in New York City.


His first column about the virus was early February.


From the beginning he wanted data, who was at risk, so as to do risk stratification.
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by vnatale » Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:19 pm

Just finished listening to Episode One of this series. Also quite good.

If you listen to it will reaffirm many of the suppositions that several of you have made here.

Episode 1: How We Got Here

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/t ... 1504360345

Vinny
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Re: Coronavirus General Discussion

Post by sophie » Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:58 pm

Well that is the epitome of "tl;dr" and I definitely didn't have time to plow through a one hour video, but basically it sounds like I would mostly agree with this guy - except for the bit about the plant based diet.

Basically I think that there are two possible endpoints to this pandemic (or rather, to the reaction to it). One is that a vaccine widely considered to be effective and safe is produced and administered to enough Americans to achieve herd immunity. The other is that the virus spreads sufficiently to achieve the same result. My money is on #2.

I absolutely agree that NY/NJ already has herd immunity, and there will be no further large outbreaks here. The ongoing protests & riots were a pretty darn good test of that assertion: they had zero effect on cases here, but I think they were the trigger for the rapid rise in cases in other states. Note that unlike in NY, the cases in other states were concentrated among young healthy people - exactly the demographic who were out there protesting. Those states will get to the same place as us in the next month or two....and that's a good thing from the point of view of getting the economy & life back to normal as quickly as possible. Well, as normal as governments allow of course...they'll try to keep up the lockdowns for far longer than necessary, and it's a matter of when people simply start ignoring the rules. That's already happening here in NY, judging by Cuomo's frequent temper tantrums on the subject.
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