Antibodies

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bedraggled
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Antibodies

Post by bedraggled » Wed Nov 13, 2019 12:31 pm

Sophie mentioned probable exposure to several bad guys that could cause illness, including Lyme disease. My parents had a house on Long Island, NY, during the outbreak of Lyme disease, starting in or about 1979. For 30 years,I cut grass, raked leaves, dug holes, traipsed through the woods, etc. Yet no Lyme whereas several of my neighbors were infected and they got bombed. I did immerse myself in the surroundings. I.e., I should have been clobbered by Lyme.

I do vaguely understand exposure and antibodies but this is one heck of an affliction.

How can one blow off such a serious illness? Ultimately, it’s a “brain eating” spirochete. I am very confused.

Thanks.
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sophie
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Re: Antibodies

Post by sophie » Thu Nov 14, 2019 8:16 am

Actually my point was that a normal immune system handles most exposures just fine. You have been exposed to lots of things that you didn't get sick from, and that's your immunoglobulins earning their keep. You have long term immunoglobulins (IgG) providing you with resistance to all sorts of things, including everything you've been vaccinated for. They will show up on a blood test, but it only means that you were exposed in the past and now have lifelong immunity. Nothing wrong with that.

The chronic Lyme club keeps intentionally trying to misunderstand this, which creates a lot of hysteria around what is in fact a fairly easily treated condition. There's also a lab whose m.o. is to churn out false positives that is favored by chronic Lyme enthusiasts because that's what they're wanting to see. Sick sick sick....but not with Lyme :-).
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Re: Antibodies

Post by boglerdude » Fri Nov 15, 2019 1:04 am

Some people just cannot accept that they have a high baseline level of anxiety or depression. There has to be a cause
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Maddy
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Re: Antibodies

Post by Maddy » Fri Nov 15, 2019 7:16 pm

boglerdude wrote:
Fri Nov 15, 2019 1:04 am
Some people just cannot accept that they have a high baseline level of anxiety or depression. There has to be a cause
Being unable to discern an objective cause doesn't mean that one doesn't exist. Consider the enormous strides being made in the area of immunology. Who would have thought that much, if not most, chronic degenerative disease has an immune component? Or that immune status is strongly linked to the various populations of microbiota that inhabit the gut? Yet most of this information is far from finding its way into the exam room.

I feel for people who go doctor to doctor in search of an explanation for why they feel so terrible--only to be told that they're anxious or depressed.
Sure, many of them are, but which is the chicken and which is the egg?
boglerdude
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Re: Antibodies

Post by boglerdude » Sat Nov 16, 2019 9:59 pm

The science doesnt support chronic lyme or fibromyalgia.

But the problem is, some people refuse to accept depression/anxiety as a possibility and they refuse to exercise, get away from toxic people, or improve diet
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sophie
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Re: Antibodies

Post by sophie » Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:37 am

boglerdude wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 9:59 pm
The science doesnt support chronic lyme or fibromyalgia.

But the problem is, some people refuse to accept depression/anxiety as a possibility and they refuse to exercise, get away from toxic people, or improve diet
Or take the medical advice and go for intensive counseling (aka cognitive behavior therapy). That's the most effective treatment for these problems (which IS proven). The saddest part is that the longer they delay CBT treatment, the worse the prognosis gets (and that also is documented).

I wish I were speaking hypothetically, but I've seen this dynamic in action not only in my physician role but also within my own extended family. On the plus side, patients who are told that their condition is psychogenic and that CBT is their best treatment, and who respond positively to the message, start improving very quickly. The ones who don't will go searching for a doctor with a different message, and they will keep getting worse. The key is in how the message is delivered. I was lucky enough to be trained by a very good psychiatrist on how to do it correctly, and I've seen what happens when it's done badly. In point of fact, when a patient is manifesting symptoms to a physician or during a test, they're really crying out for help.

To be fair, mysterious symptoms and labels of "fibromyalgia" etc are not always psychogenic. This is where a careful examination comes in, and determining whether signs are consistent. I remember one case from residency where the patient was faking dyscoordination - but she only remembered to do it during the formal exam. All I had to do to catch her out was to ask her to turn off the TV hanging over her bed. Similarly, the extended family member constantly complains of severe knee pain, which the quack du jour diagnosed as small fiber neuropathy. Once when she was over for a visit, I took her for a walk. On the way out, she went straight down the staircase no problem. Plus a perfectly normal, narrow based fast gait when she was distracted. A small fiber neuropathy or significant knee pain would have made both of those impossible. QED.
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