Is Trump doing a good job?

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dualstow
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Wed Nov 13, 2019 9:11 am

pugchief wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 7:42 pm
dualstow wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 5:53 pm
He might not be the smartest guy, Sophie.
Au contraire. And I think Kriegs is over thinking it. To me it's simple. As Bill Clinton famously said, "It's the economy, stupid." If the market tanks between now and the election, it makes Trump's reelection prospects more difficult. How do you goose the economy and insure a stock market rally? Lower interest rates. Trump knows this, and if he can talk the Fed into doing it, the economic reaction will make him look really good right before the vote.
I guess.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Sun Nov 17, 2019 4:43 pm

technovelist wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:34 pm
Disagree on gold: it would go to the moon.
Tech, maybe six months ago, you asked what specifically I didn’t like about Trump’s actions or policies (not words), and I’ve certainly been taking my time to supply more than a few. There are some that actions and policies i like.

But, it’s time to add two more glaring problems to the list:
ALLOWING TURKEY TO MASSACRE KURDS // if I didn’t mention it before
WITNESS INTIMIDATION. // fairly fresh, of course

*Never mind the moon quote. I just wanted a quote in your notifications.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:51 pm

I started this thread with Martin Indyk’s attack on Trump’s Mideast policy, from Foreign Affairs.

Here’s an excerpt of the opposing opinion from Michael Doran ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Scott_Doran ), from the same issue.
...as the Palestinians have remained impoverished wards of the international community, with threats of terror their chief negotiating tool. Most Arab states moved on long ago. They now treat Israel as a normal player in the eternal great game of regional power balancing. So now has the Trump administration. And for that, it has been excoriated.

The administration’s approach is a disaster, critics say, because it concedes so much to Israel upfront that the Palestinians will never agree to negotiate. The critics are correct about the unlikely prospects for a deal anytime soon. But that makes the Trump administration different from its predecessors how? U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry squandered more than a year of the Obama administration trying in vain to jump-start peace talks, a quixotic effort that even his own negotiators knew would not succeed. Is that the benchmark against which Trump is to be judged? If so, he will end up failing a lot more cheaply.
Hmm.
(link, paywalled though https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles ... -americans)
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by technovelist » Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:57 pm

dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 4:43 pm
technovelist wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:34 pm
Disagree on gold: it would go to the moon.
Tech, maybe six months ago, you asked what specifically I didn’t like about Trump’s actions or policies (not words), and I’ve certainly been taking my time to supply more than a few. There are some that actions and policies i like.

But, it’s time to add two more glaring problems to the list:
ALLOWING TURKEY TO MASSACRE KURDS // if I didn’t mention it before
WITNESS INTIMIDATION. // fairly fresh, of course

*Never mind the moon quote. I just wanted a quote in your notifications.
The beef between Turkey and the Kurds is none of our business. Those people have been killing each other for centuries, and getting in the middle of that is a certain recipe for disaster.

As for "witness intimidation", did you know that the witness would never have known about the "mean tweet" during her testimony if Schiff hadn't read it to her.

Also, the definition of "witness intimidation" doesn't cover this situation anyway: "Witness intimidation means the threatening of a crucial court witnesses by pressure or extortion to compel him/her to not to testify." (https://definitions.uslegal.com/w/witness-intimidation/)

There was no threat and she was not a "crucial witness", since she witnessed nothing.

Of course I know why you are grasping at straws. You don't have anything.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:43 pm

technovelist wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:57 pm
The beef between Turkey and the Kurds is none of our business. Those people have been killing each other for centuries, and getting in the middle of that is a certain recipe for disaster.

Ok, but don’t you think we got in the Kurds’ business long enough to receive help from them, so that we should help them back instead of screwing them over and leaving them to be slaughtered? A simple this for that or what do they call it? Quid pro quo.

As for "witness intimidation", did you know that the witness would never have known about the "mean tweet" during her testimony if Schiff hadn't read it to her.
I did not and do not know that. Trump doesn’t tweet for his own consumption. When the President tweets about you, one is going to hear about it. I only remember her speaking about the torment in the past tense, and in plural “days.”
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by l82start » Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:19 pm

dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:43 pm
technovelist wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:57 pm
The beef between Turkey and the Kurds is none of our business. Those people have been killing each other for centuries, and getting in the middle of that is a certain recipe for disaster.

Ok, but don’t you think we got in the Kurds’ business long enough to receive help from them, so that we should help them back instead of screwing them over and leaving them to be slaughtered? A simple this for that or what do they call it? Quid pro quo.
i agree we should help them ..but..
there is more than one way to support the kurds. Boots on the ground may be the go to solution for those with a vested interest in the perma-war state, just not necessarily the best solution for Americans or the Kurds.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by vnatale » Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:35 pm

technovelist wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:57 pm
dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 4:43 pm
technovelist wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:34 pm
Disagree on gold: it would go to the moon.
Tech, maybe six months ago, you asked what specifically I didn’t like about Trump’s actions or policies (not words), and I’ve certainly been taking my time to supply more than a few. There are some that actions and policies i like.

But, it’s time to add two more glaring problems to the list:
ALLOWING TURKEY TO MASSACRE KURDS // if I didn’t mention it before
WITNESS INTIMIDATION. // fairly fresh, of course

*Never mind the moon quote. I just wanted a quote in your notifications.
The beef between Turkey and the Kurds is none of our business. Those people have been killing each other for centuries, and getting in the middle of that is a certain recipe for disaster.

As for "witness intimidation", did you know that the witness would never have known about the "mean tweet" during her testimony if Schiff hadn't read it to her.

Also, the definition of "witness intimidation" doesn't cover this situation anyway: "Witness intimidation means the threatening of a crucial court witnesses by pressure or extortion to compel him/her to not to testify." (https://definitions.uslegal.com/w/witness-intimidation/)

There was no threat and she was not a "crucial witness", since she witnessed nothing.

Of course I know why you are grasping at straws. You don't have anything.
I believe that there was a break shortly after Schiff had read it to her. It's a near certainty even if Schiff had not read it to her, she would have been told about it by someone(s) during that break.

And, it comes down to how one interprets both "pressure" and "crucial witness". It's clear how you are interpreting both of them but that does not make either interpretation definitive.

Vinny
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by technovelist » Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:41 pm

vnatale wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:35 pm
technovelist wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:57 pm
dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 4:43 pm
technovelist wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:34 pm
Disagree on gold: it would go to the moon.
Tech, maybe six months ago, you asked what specifically I didn’t like about Trump’s actions or policies (not words), and I’ve certainly been taking my time to supply more than a few. There are some that actions and policies i like.

But, it’s time to add two more glaring problems to the list:
ALLOWING TURKEY TO MASSACRE KURDS // if I didn’t mention it before
WITNESS INTIMIDATION. // fairly fresh, of course

*Never mind the moon quote. I just wanted a quote in your notifications.
The beef between Turkey and the Kurds is none of our business. Those people have been killing each other for centuries, and getting in the middle of that is a certain recipe for disaster.

As for "witness intimidation", did you know that the witness would never have known about the "mean tweet" during her testimony if Schiff hadn't read it to her.

Also, the definition of "witness intimidation" doesn't cover this situation anyway: "Witness intimidation means the threatening of a crucial court witnesses by pressure or extortion to compel him/her to not to testify." (https://definitions.uslegal.com/w/witness-intimidation/)

There was no threat and she was not a "crucial witness", since she witnessed nothing.

Of course I know why you are grasping at straws. You don't have anything.
I believe that there was a break shortly after Schiff had read it to her. It's a near certainty even if Schiff had not read it to her, she would have been told about it by someone(s) during that break.

And, it comes down to how one interprets both "pressure" and "crucial witness". It's clear how you are interpreting both of them but that does not make either interpretation definitive.

Vinny
TDS will make you see things that aren't there.
I'm not going to read your posts on political topics anymore, as they contain nothing but your completely biased opinions.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by technovelist » Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:42 pm

l82start wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:19 pm
dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:43 pm
technovelist wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:57 pm
The beef between Turkey and the Kurds is none of our business. Those people have been killing each other for centuries, and getting in the middle of that is a certain recipe for disaster.

Ok, but don’t you think we got in the Kurds’ business long enough to receive help from them, so that we should help them back instead of screwing them over and leaving them to be slaughtered? A simple this for that or what do they call it? Quid pro quo.
i agree we should help them ..but..
there is more than one way to support the kurds. Boots on the ground may be the go to solution for those with a vested interest in the perma-war state, just not necessarily the best solution for Americans or the Kurds.
Yes, the permanent-war party is very upset with Trump because he isn't onboard with that.
You would think that most Americans would agree with Trump, but people with severe cases of TDS can't agree with him even if he is doing what they think would be a good idea if anyone else did it.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:48 pm

l82start wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:19 pm
i agree we should help them ..but..
there is more than one way to support the kurds. Boots on the ground may be the go to solution for those with a vested interest in the perma-war state, just not necessarily the best solution for Americans or the Kurds.
We helped the Hmong permanently settle in the States. Are you thinking something along those lines? If not, then——?
From the Kurdish point of view, it must look strange. We’re fine making war with ISIS and the reward the Kurds get for fighting on our side is: we are a peace-loving nation and have decided to stop fighting at this time. You’re on your own with the Kurds.

Or, maybe Trump has a thing for dictators and strongmen. There are things I like about the Trump administrations’ actions and by tech’s own definition of TDS, that disqualifies me. Putin, Kim, Duterte, Bolsonaro, and Erdogan. He loves the despots.
I hope we get something out of this move.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by l82start » Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:39 pm

dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:48 pm
l82start wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:19 pm
i agree we should help them ..but..
there is more than one way to support the kurds. Boots on the ground may be the go to solution for those with a vested interest in the perma-war state, just not necessarily the best solution for Americans or the Kurds.
We helped the Hmong permanently settle in the States. Are you thinking something along those lines? If not, then——?
From the Kurdish point of view, it must look strange. We’re fine making war with ISIS and the reward the Kurds get for fighting on our side is: we are a peace-loving nation and have decided to stop fighting at this time. You’re on your own with the Kurds.

Or, maybe Trump has a thing for dictators and strongmen. There are things I like about the Trump administrations’ actions and by tech’s own definition of TDS, that disqualifies me. Putin, Kim, Duterte, Bolsonaro, and Erdogan. He loves the despots.
I hope we get something out of this move.
i hadn't considered resettling but ..sure... its one tool in the list of a bunch that could be used, humanitarian aid, (food, water, medical care) international sanctions against the aggressors, no fly zones, provide military Intel, training, weapons/ammunition. and undoubtedly others that i haven't heard mentioned or suggested yet.. ...mix and match.... use what makes the best strategic and diplomatic sense based on an accurate understanding of the immediate situation, and the big picture..
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but with a bureaucrat

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by technovelist » Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:47 am

dualstow wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:48 pm
l82start wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:19 pm
i agree we should help them ..but..
there is more than one way to support the kurds. Boots on the ground may be the go to solution for those with a vested interest in the perma-war state, just not necessarily the best solution for Americans or the Kurds.
We helped the Hmong permanently settle in the States. Are you thinking something along those lines? If not, then——?
From the Kurdish point of view, it must look strange. We’re fine making war with ISIS and the reward the Kurds get for fighting on our side is: we are a peace-loving nation and have decided to stop fighting at this time. You’re on your own with the Kurds.

Or, maybe Trump has a thing for dictators and strongmen. There are things I like about the Trump administrations’ actions and by tech’s own definition of TDS, that disqualifies me. Putin, Kim, Duterte, Bolsonaro, and Erdogan. He loves the despots.
I hope we get something out of this move.
Note: I'm not a psychiatrist, so this is not medical advice.

There are different stages of TDS. We are still in the early days of research on this plague affecting society, but here's a rough guideline for diagnosing a patient:

Stage 1: Thinks Trump is bad and Trump supporters are deluded but not necessarily evil. Has absorbed some but not all of the propaganda about Trump's being racist, liking dictators, and the like. If shown some achievement that the patient would agree with if it were the work of someone other than Trump, e.g., VA reform, tax reform, or prison reform such as the First Step Act, agrees that it is a good achievement. The patient will improve his opinion of Trump slightly after this.

Stage 2: Knows Trump is evil and a threat to society, but probably not as bad as Hitler, whereas Trump supporters are dumb hicks like on Hee-Haw. Spouts some Democrat talking points easily but doesn't have all the current ones memorized. If shown an achievement as above, denigrates it as being not of any importance, or says Obama is responsible for it.

Stage 3: Trump is not only evil, but as bad as Hitler, and his supporters are Nazi sympathizers. Knows all of the current talking points and will bring them up on any topic that is even tangentially related to politics. If shown an achievement as above, says it is positively horrific even though the patient would have thought it was wonderful if someone else had done it.

Stage 4: Trump is worse than Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini combined, and his supporters are a combination of Nazis and KKK members. Keeps up with intraday changes to talking points and cannot discuss any topic without bringing up Trump and blaming him. Trump has turned the US into a dystopian horror for which the only possible remedy is the extermination of him and his followers.

Hope that helps.
Last edited by technovelist on Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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