Where are you invested in gold?
Moderator: Global Moderator
Where are you invested in gold?
Half of my gold portion of the PP has been invested in PHYS since GTU was taken over in a rather hostile manner. The other half is in KRands. Since then I have never been very comfortable with PHYS and would like to invest elsewhere. What are your choices and why.
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
I've used SGOL, IAU, and physical but recently I dropped the SGOL and went with just the latter two. Don't actually remember why I made that move, to tell you the truth.
I think IAU was the original recommendation in the Harry Browne book so that's why I went with it. He preferred physical gold, of course, and suggested some of it be stored outside the country. About 20% of my gold is physical right now and at this point I don't intend to ever increase that amount. I've read all about the risks of "paper gold" and having it held by a third party but the more I think about it, it occurs to me that holding physical gold is not without its own risks, especially in a foreign country, so I'm just going to keep what I have right now as an insurance policy with the intention of eventually passing it on to my heirs if it's left unspent.
I think IAU was the original recommendation in the Harry Browne book so that's why I went with it. He preferred physical gold, of course, and suggested some of it be stored outside the country. About 20% of my gold is physical right now and at this point I don't intend to ever increase that amount. I've read all about the risks of "paper gold" and having it held by a third party but the more I think about it, it occurs to me that holding physical gold is not without its own risks, especially in a foreign country, so I'm just going to keep what I have right now as an insurance policy with the intention of eventually passing it on to my heirs if it's left unspent.
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
For me it was a choice between GLD and IAU, since they were, and still are, the two big dogs for Gold ETFs. IAU's superior ER made it an easy choice.
I'd own some physical gold if I felt I could secure it soundly with little cost, but that's not my current situation.
I'd own some physical gold if I felt I could secure it soundly with little cost, but that's not my current situation.
Don't agree with me too strongly or I'm going to change my mind
-
- Executive Member
- Posts: 1317
- Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2016 1:40 am
- Contact:
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
Using PHYS but CEF might've been a better choice as someone here said Sprott is a little shady.
Might take another look at Perth Mint
Might take another look at Perth Mint
-
- Executive Member
- Posts: 5994
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 6:00 pm
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
How about Global Gold?boglerdude wrote:Using PHYS but CEF might've been a better choice as someone here said Sprott is a little shady.
Might take another look at Perth Mint
- InsuranceGuy
- Executive Member
- Posts: 425
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2015 1:44 pm
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
[deleted]
Last edited by InsuranceGuy on Mon Mar 08, 2021 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
Perth Mint for me. Only using the allocated option, where my holdings are isolated.
And just for a trial, I requested some coins get delivered to myself, and yes, they arrived.
PS. HB might have been onto something when he recommended holding coins.
Mexico thinking about remonetising bullion coins. Anyone know more details?
http://plata.com.mx/enUS/More/330?idioma=2
And just for a trial, I requested some coins get delivered to myself, and yes, they arrived.
PS. HB might have been onto something when he recommended holding coins.
Mexico thinking about remonetising bullion coins. Anyone know more details?
http://plata.com.mx/enUS/More/330?idioma=2
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
I've got a mix:
1/3 gold American Eagles in a safe deposit box
almost 2/3 is gold ETFs in tax-advantaged accounts: IAU, some PHYS, some SGOL.
the rest is unallocated at Perth Mint, under their online depository account
I've got too much in gold ETFs for my preference, but it worked out that way because of a lot of my PP is in tax-advantaged. I'm considering converting the Roth ETFs to Fidelity's IRA bullion program, which is kind of like pool allocated and stored in Nova Scotia.
The Perth Mint slice is small but I have it set up with regular contributions to minimize purchasing fees. When it gets large enough to convert to allocated bars I might do that, but leaving it unallocated is probably no less safe (and certainly saves on storage costs). That's because the main risk is a hacker breaking into Perth Mint's online servers, and wreaking havoc with their account records. At least that's the risk I'm most worried about.
1/3 gold American Eagles in a safe deposit box
almost 2/3 is gold ETFs in tax-advantaged accounts: IAU, some PHYS, some SGOL.
the rest is unallocated at Perth Mint, under their online depository account
I've got too much in gold ETFs for my preference, but it worked out that way because of a lot of my PP is in tax-advantaged. I'm considering converting the Roth ETFs to Fidelity's IRA bullion program, which is kind of like pool allocated and stored in Nova Scotia.
The Perth Mint slice is small but I have it set up with regular contributions to minimize purchasing fees. When it gets large enough to convert to allocated bars I might do that, but leaving it unallocated is probably no less safe (and certainly saves on storage costs). That's because the main risk is a hacker breaking into Perth Mint's online servers, and wreaking havoc with their account records. At least that's the risk I'm most worried about.
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
Haven't seen this discussed in a bit...sophie wrote:I've got too much in gold ETFs for my preference, but it worked out that way because of a lot of my PP is in tax-advantaged.
For those of you who maintain a PP across several different types of accounts (taxable, tax-deferred, tax-free), what percentage in gold ETFs do you shoot for in Roths and tIRAs?
I'm at a bit over 25%. It feels like I am not taking full advantage of the tax benefits of that space. Seems like it should be loaded up with stocks, bonds and cash that are throwing off potentially-taxable dividends and interest. But I like having gold in there so that a decade like the 2000s doesn't hit those accounts too hard. And it's nice to be able to buy and sell IAU without worrying about tax implications, mark up, etc.
Do all these factors just balance one another out? Should I go worry about something else?
- Kriegsspiel
- Executive Member
- Posts: 4052
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:28 pm
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
100% Bullion. I'm underwater on all of it.
0%barrett wrote: For those of you who maintain a PP across several different types of accounts (taxable, tax-deferred, tax-free), what percentage in gold ETFs do you shoot for in Roths and tIRAs?
-
- Executive Member
- Posts: 5994
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 6:00 pm
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
So you are another victim of the rowboat curse?Kriegsspiel wrote:100% Bullion. I'm underwater on all of it.
- Kriegsspiel
- Executive Member
- Posts: 4052
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:28 pm
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
1/2 mix of IAU and SGOL because they're available and cheap.
1/2 bullion (Buffalo) through Fidelity. I don't like the responsibility of securing and selling coins (or foisting the same on my survivors). Fidelity bullion gives me a chunk that's plainly worth what the metal is worth and theoretically is salable during market holidays. It takes a phone call and hefty commissions to buy and sell, so it's essentially permanently stashed away where I won't mess with it. I have read the ETFs' prospectuses and am comfortable with the risks, but why not take the extra diversification for gold expected to be held for a long time?
All in tax-advantaged accounts not because of gold specifics but because lopsided accounts and emergency fund considerations dominate that decision.
1/2 bullion (Buffalo) through Fidelity. I don't like the responsibility of securing and selling coins (or foisting the same on my survivors). Fidelity bullion gives me a chunk that's plainly worth what the metal is worth and theoretically is salable during market holidays. It takes a phone call and hefty commissions to buy and sell, so it's essentially permanently stashed away where I won't mess with it. I have read the ETFs' prospectuses and am comfortable with the risks, but why not take the extra diversification for gold expected to be held for a long time?
All in tax-advantaged accounts not because of gold specifics but because lopsided accounts and emergency fund considerations dominate that decision.
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
Shawn, glad to hear someone else has tried that Fidelity bullion program. I noticed a while ago they'd lowered their prices, so the fees are comparable to the ETFs if you hold it for a few years. I don't know why I've been hesitant to pull the trigger, I guess because no one else on the board has tried it to my (prior) knowledge.
Some money in ETFs is nice for ease of selling. 25% max though. ETFs make me nervous because they're untested in some market environments, including precisely the ones you need gold for. I'll still be stuck with them in some accounts, because that bullion program only applies to IRAs.
Some money in ETFs is nice for ease of selling. 25% max though. ETFs make me nervous because they're untested in some market environments, including precisely the ones you need gold for. I'll still be stuck with them in some accounts, because that bullion program only applies to IRAs.
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
It was your thread that tipped me off that the storage fees had come down. That’s when I pulled the trigger. Thanks, Sophie!sophie wrote:Shawn, glad to hear someone else has tried that Fidelity bullion program. I noticed a while ago they'd lowered their prices, so the fees are comparable to the ETFs if you hold it for a few years. I don't know why I've been hesitant to pull the trigger, I guess because no one else on the board has tried it to my (prior) knowledge.
Some money in ETFs is nice for ease of selling. 25% max though. ETFs make me nervous because they're untested in some market environments, including precisely the ones you need gold for. I'll still be stuck with them in some accounts, because that bullion program only applies to IRAs.
-
- Executive Member
- Posts: 1317
- Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2016 1:40 am
- Contact:
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
For Perth unallocated coins:
https://www.perthmint.com/storage/pricing.html
1% fee to buy or sell. Of the day's spot price?
No storage fee.
If you want the actual coins, convert to allocated, and pay 5% fabrication fee.
What type of gold coins do they send? Do they report sales or anything to IRS?
https://www.perthmint.com/storage/pricing.html
1% fee to buy or sell. Of the day's spot price?
No storage fee.
If you want the actual coins, convert to allocated, and pay 5% fabrication fee.
What type of gold coins do they send? Do they report sales or anything to IRS?
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
Hi Boglerdude,boglerdude wrote:For Perth unallocated coins:
https://www.perthmint.com/storage/pricing.html
1% fee to buy or sell. Of the day's spot price?
No storage fee.
If you want the actual coins, convert to allocated, and pay 5% fabrication fee.
What type of gold coins do they send? Do they report sales or anything to IRS?
I have only purchased allocated coins, however the cost was based on the exact time the order was placed. See link.
The coins received were Kangaroos, however frankly I don't really care. I think its just what they are minting at the time.
All financial transactions over 10,000 AUD are reported to the Government, and I would imagine that is shared with the USA. Supposedly, its to stop terrorist (coin collectors ?? ), but I think its more to do with chasing taxes.
http://www.perthmintbullion.com/au/default.aspx
Hope this helps,
Hal
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
For pool allocated storage in an IRA, I'd say Fidelity's 0.5% storage fee is a pretty good deal, and within the ballpark of an ETF's expense ratio (0.4% except for IAU). It used to be something like 2% a year. Buy/sell fees are not a big deal for long term holdings, which is what you would want to use this for.
Regarding Perth Mint: if you trust the online depository account, it's almost a no-brainer to put your taxable, buy & hold ETF money there, because of the free storage. From there you have the option of converting to allocated storage, for which you pay storage charges, fabrication fees, and eventually additional fees to convert back to unallocated to sell.
The tax implications of Perth Mint gets complicated. The Mint set up the accounts so that they're not a bank, and they state on the website that they do not report transactions to the US government. However, you're still required to comply with the foreign account reporting laws, and note your money transfers to the Mint create a paper trail. You're responsible for tracking your cost basis, which gets tricky because the Perth Mint doesn't track it for you - you'd have to scan through collected monthly statements to figure it out. Hopefully there's a year-end statement I'll be able to download and save.
Regarding Perth Mint: if you trust the online depository account, it's almost a no-brainer to put your taxable, buy & hold ETF money there, because of the free storage. From there you have the option of converting to allocated storage, for which you pay storage charges, fabrication fees, and eventually additional fees to convert back to unallocated to sell.
The tax implications of Perth Mint gets complicated. The Mint set up the accounts so that they're not a bank, and they state on the website that they do not report transactions to the US government. However, you're still required to comply with the foreign account reporting laws, and note your money transfers to the Mint create a paper trail. You're responsible for tracking your cost basis, which gets tricky because the Perth Mint doesn't track it for you - you'd have to scan through collected monthly statements to figure it out. Hopefully there's a year-end statement I'll be able to download and save.
- Cortopassi
- Executive Member
- Posts: 3338
- Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:28 pm
- Location: https://www.jwst.nasa.gov/content/webbL ... sWebb.html
Re: Where are you invested in gold?
Another interesting possibility for an area to invest in (eventually?) or stay completely away from. Crypto currency backed by gold.
https://www.themaven.net/mishtalk/econo ... dmjHVgwyYg
I know nothing about crypto stuff other than I had never planned to ever get into them, but I will at least research this.
Not entirely sure how this is different from GoldMoney.
https://www.themaven.net/mishtalk/econo ... dmjHVgwyYg
I know nothing about crypto stuff other than I had never planned to ever get into them, but I will at least research this.
Not entirely sure how this is different from GoldMoney.