Any downside to bars?

[ochotona]

I'm thinking of buying 10 oz Perth Mint gold bars, and I don't intend to remove the tamper-resistant packaging. Does anyone see any downside relative to coins? They are about 2% over spot.

[mathjak107]

you may have to pay an assay fee when selling . they hammered me on that fee many years ago selling silver bars .

[ochotona]

you may have to pay an assay fee when selling . they hammered me on that fee many years ago selling silver bars .

I hope to sell back to the same dealer someday, or my heirs will. I'll ask them. Anyone else get hit with assay fees if you kept the gold bar in the original tamper resistant serial numbered packaging?

[sophie]

For gold in my own possession, I'd rather stick with coins that are metal alloys. They will be more resistant to damage from handling and the elements. So for example that rules out Canadian Maple Leafs, as well as bars.

If you're buying from the Perth Mint, are you going to use their allocated storage? It's a pretty hefty minimum ($50K) but if you're talking about 10 oz bars in plural I guess that's not a problem.

[ochotona]

If you're buying from the Perth Mint, are you going to use their allocated storage? It's a pretty hefty minimum ($50K) but if you're talking about 10 oz bars in plural I guess that's not a problem.

I think about allocated storage all the time, but I'm not convinced of why it helps when it's not in the USA. It is a "foreign bank account?" - that whole thing. If I redeem online and money starts flowing from AUS to USA, that's a highly visible event. If I travel there (very nice city, by the way), I can't take +$10,000 back in cash on a plane unless I declare it. I can't take my own gold bars back unless I declare them and then do I have to pay import duty on my own property and fight with Customs over that, but they have my money already?

[sophie]

I don't think there's any way to truly hide your gold overseas, but the idea is that simply making it harder to access than cash in a US bank account can be helpful in case of a legal action. The Perth Mint depository program or depository online accounts are not bank accounts, and the Perth Mint will not provide information directly to the US government. Also, you CAN bring more than $10K into the US without paying fees, you just have to declare it.

I don't think there's any way to possess gold that doesn't have some sort of risk. All you can really do is diversify it, through a combination of gold held at home, in a safety deposit box, and at bank and non-bank storage facilities inside and outside the US.

[Libertarian666]

10 oz. is a pretty big chunk to have to liquidate at one time, but otherwise I think it will be okay if you keep them in the original packaging.

At least when I sold Kitco bars that were still in the original packaging, I didn't need to pay any assay charges even when selling to another dealer besides Kitco.

[dualstow]

I'm thinking of buying 10 oz Perth Mint gold bars, and I don't intend to remove the tamper-resistant packaging. Does anyone see any downside relative to coins? They are about 2% over spot.

If it weren't from Perth Mint and in tamper resistant pkg'ing, I'd be worried about the fact that it's easier to make tungsten bars than tungsten coins, but you have that covered. I got a good feeling about the Perth Mint from Bron's posts here. Btw, he left - http://research.perthmint.com.au/

Bron Suchecki departs The Perth Mint

- Mar 22, 2016

But if you were buying a coin a month, or at least a coin at a time, why the jump to bars? Just for the ~2% markup advantage? (Assuming coins are about 4% markup).

[ochotona]

But if you were buying a coin a month, or at least a coin at a time, why the jump to bars? Just for the ~2% markup advantage? (Assuming coins are about 4% markup).

Yes, just for the markup advantage. If there was no price difference I wouldn't do it. For the amount I want to buy, it makes a difference. The change of US President accelerates the possibility of a Black Swan event in my mind, and I don't want to run out of time. I really need to pick up the gold buying pace. What an annoyance that the price jumped up on me in 2016.

[dualstow]

I have to say I'm feeling your influence. I used to buy 10 at a time (very infrequently). Then I switched to 1 or 2 for dollar cost averaging.

Lately, I've been thinking about another tube, but now I have to consider this bar.

Btw, did anyone else read that Prince died with a fortune in real estate + 67 gold bars? He did.

[Libertarian666]

But if you were buying a coin a month, or at least a coin at a time, why the jump to bars? Just for the ~2% markup advantage? (Assuming coins are about 4% markup).

Yes, just for the markup advantage. If there was no price difference I wouldn't do it. For the amount I want to buy, it makes a difference. The change of US President accelerates the possibility of a Black Swan event in my mind, and I don't want to run out of time. I really need to pick up the gold buying pace. What an annoyance that the price jumped up on me in 2016.

If the amount you are going to buy means that the 2% markup makes a significant different, kilo bars probably have even smaller spreads. But the 400 oz. good delivery bar has the lowest premium, saving about $1/oz. over the 100 oz. bar and $10/oz. over the 10 oz. bar, if I'm doing the math right.

[ochotona]

If the amount you are going to buy means that the 2% markup makes a significant different, kilo bars probably have even smaller spreads. But the 400 oz. good delivery bar has the lowest premium, saving about $1/oz. over the 100 oz. bar and $10/oz. over the 10 oz. bar, if I'm doing the math right.

Kilos are mandatory 1099 reportable. Also not sure if I can buy an even number of kilos. I have two kids!

[fi50@fi2023]

On the opposite end of the spectrum.... do any of you purchase coins smaller than 1 oz? I wonder if smaller coins would be more useful in a SHTF scenario as a means of trade.

[ochotona]

SHTF? Cheap booze, condoms, 9 mm, .223, .22, marijuana, junk silver, cigarettes, vape juice, toilet paper, beef jerky, better than gold.

[Xan]

I got a good feeling about the Perth Mint from Bron's posts here. Btw, he left - http://research.perthmint.com.au/

Bron Suchecki departs The Perth Mint

- Mar 22, 2016

He seems to have turned up here:
https://monetary-metals.com/about-us/

[Libertarian666]

On the opposite end of the spectrum.... do any of you purchase coins smaller than 1 oz? I wonder if smaller coins would be more useful in a SHTF scenario as a means of trade.

Junk silver, e.g., dimes and quarters are probably best for that. Even a 1/20th ounce gold coin is too big a unit for most everyday purchases, and is likely to have a high premium as well.

[Libertarian666]

SHTF? Cheap booze, condoms, 9 mm, .223, .22, marijuana, junk silver, cigarettes, vape juice, toilet paper, beef jerky, better than gold.

Great list (I won't comment on my massive stash of condoms).

Regarding junk silver: in a SHTF scenario, do you think the general public is educated enough regarding coin dates and weights to recognize the value of junk silver?

Most older people will recognize it, but you might want to keep some printed copies of coin specs around just in case.

[l82start]

i think people would learn it pretty fast, plus black market money exchanges are likely to be a boom business..
- there is always bullion coin silver as an easier to recognize option.

[dualstow]

Great list (I won't comment on my massive stash of condoms).

"There must be some mistake. I wanted to reserve a bunch of condos!"

[ochotona]

I made the Big Buy (for me) of two 10 oz bars yesterday, too bad those statements were made about weakening the US Dollar, which spiked gold. That's how it goes. I'm getting close to what I consider minimal portfolio insurance, 5% gold. Goal is 10% (per Jim Rickards). When I hit 5% in a few weeks I'm going to become more selective once again about price, and try to fish for $1000-$1100. I do have a position in miners PSAU so if gold spikes up wildly up, I'll sell my miner stock and buy physical. At 10% I'll go to sleep, unless gold gets ridiculous, like Harry S. Dent ridiculous ($250-$700), at which case I might even go for Golden Butterfly (20%) or Permanent Portfolio (25%) allocations. It all depends on price, and it may be partly ETF, for trading.

[dualstow]

You've got two lucky children.

[ochotona]

You've got two lucky children.

I am a lucky Father! Two great kids. All grown up.

[ochotona]

Got the bars, and very pleased with them.

[dualstow]

If, say, 10 years from now gold triples in value, will you feel nervous about transporting them?

[ochotona]

If, say, 10 years from now gold triples in value, will you feel nervous about transporting them?

I chose the bank with great care... I will come and go prepared for whatever because they don't abridge my rights. It's a sleepy little Texas town. Nothing happens there. Also “This is the only bank in the United States that didn’t close for the Roosevelt Bank holiday, and our customers’ like that just fine.”

http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2015/04/ ... -ever-did/

If / when they get it up and running, and depending on the cost, I may use the future Texas Gold Depository.