Sydney Powell's defense

User avatar
doodle
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4603
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:17 pm

Sydney Powell's defense

Post by doodle » Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:03 am


Lawyers for pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell said that “no reasonable person” would believe that her false conspiracies about the 2020 election were “truly statements of fact.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/pro-tr ... act.html
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:39 pm

doodle wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:03 am

Lawyers for pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell said that “no reasonable person” would believe that her false conspiracies about the 2020 election were “truly statements of fact.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/pro-tr ... act.html
Trumpism is a cultish-religion that lies within the already cultish-religion of statism.
glennds
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 726
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:24 am

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by glennds » Tue Mar 23, 2021 11:08 pm

I don't recall who it was but someone on this board was a big fan of Sidney Powell, referring to her as a "beast" that would unleash the kraken and expose all the fraud, just you wait.
Beast=Clown?
User avatar
pugchief
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4492
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:41 pm
Location: suburbs of Chicago, IL

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by pugchief » Wed Mar 24, 2021 6:48 am

moda0306 wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:39 pm

Trumpism is a cultish-religion that lies within the already cultish-religion of statism.
Yes. Unlike that completely uncultish Leftism. ::)
User avatar
I Shrugged
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:35 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by I Shrugged » Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:18 am

At least there are no clowns on the left.
glennds
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 726
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:24 am

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by glennds » Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:33 am

I Shrugged wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:18 am
At least there are no clowns on the left.
At least none that have claimed they were about to expose the greatest conspiracy in the history of mankind. And then when held accountable, took as a defense the position that their claims were so outlandish that no reasonable person could believe them.
Yes, plenty of clowns on the left, but Sidney Powell is in her own category.
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:03 am

I Shrugged wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:18 am
At least there are no clowns on the left.
Sure there are. Like I said, statism itself is a cultish religion. I what makes you think that wouldn’t include your definition of “the left?”
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:47 am

pugchief wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 6:48 am
moda0306 wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:39 pm

Trumpism is a cultish-religion that lies within the already cultish-religion of statism.
Yes. Unlike that completely uncultish Leftism. ::)
Nah "lefitsim" as you probably would define it (Anything left of centrism) has plenty of cultish/religious dogma peddlers and followers. Funnily enough, I find people modestly left of center but who are politically active to be far more cultish than the "hard-left." But I'm defining hard-left as people I follow who are self-described socialists, social democrats, etc who are far more interested in producing actual policy changes (many I disagree with) than constantly engaging in the partisan scramble to blindly defend whatever senile or corporate hack the D's have decided to put in front of us. The latter is the religious aspect. Simply deeply believing in $15 minimum wage or public housing is just a policy preference difference.

You might also be thinking of the "woke cult," which certainly exists and isn't my jam, though it's just one fetish of many of the cultish masses. These are sub-issues that tend to serve the larger religious dogmatism. Kind of like making excuses for killer cops on the right isn't necessarily a philosophical defense of the police state, but more a way to signal your allegiance to a team.

To that point, I'd say the same about the right, to a degree. The hard-right, if right is defined in economic terms, was somewhat split on Trump. Partly because, ultimately, he was offering tax cuts and regulatory slashes, which get you 80% of the way into a conservative's economic heart, even if you throw some tariffs in the pot to boot. Or maybe it's the "foreign-policy conservatives" (if we can even call them that) who hate Trump for making a mockery of the Empire, even if he largely walked in lock-step with it in the end. We know the white-nash wing of conservatives loved the guy, but those other two wings were at least somewhat split. Let's also not forget that on presentation alone, Trump was a borderline parody of anti-conservative behavior/decorum. So some people simply weren't able to hold back their gag reflex, policy aside. Part of me wants to ridicule this for its allegiance to performative nonsense like slick speeches and "seeming" like a good guy, but there is something to be said about having qualms about putting someone who can't even pretend to act like a decent human being to head of the most powerful killing machine in the world.

There were some wings of conservatives that thought independently, even if I disagree with them as well on policy... but It's the enthusiasm and faux anti-establishment sentiment of the Trumpanzees, and the fact they're forced to defend ever-more obnoxious behavior, that makes them a uniquely obnoxious subset of the conservative cult of the statism religion. At least the ones that actually hold/held substantial violent power in the U.S.
Last edited by moda0306 on Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Mark Leavy
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 1544
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:20 pm
Location: US Citizen, Permanent Traveler

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by Mark Leavy » Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:53 am

doodle wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:03 am

Lawyers for pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell said that “no reasonable person” would believe that her false conspiracies about the 2020 election were “truly statements of fact.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/pro-tr ... act.html
Brilliant! If I am ever charged with anything, I am totally going with the Chewbacca Defense. That's why Sydney makes the big bucks. I expect her to prevail.
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 10:29 am

glennds wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:33 am
I Shrugged wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:18 am
At least there are no clowns on the left.
At least none that have claimed they were about to expose the greatest conspiracy in the history of mankind. And then when held accountable, took as a defense the position that their claims were so outlandish that no reasonable person could believe them.
Yes, plenty of clowns on the left, but Sidney Powell is in her own category.
They were clowns well-before the election stuff. This was just the obvious place the whole roof was going to blow off his act. If Barack Hussein Obama had done but a fraction of what Trump did, we'd have had red states seceding left and right.

Just paint this mental picture... black dude who's turned himself into the ultimate liberal culture warrior by utterly ridiculing a popular 2-term republican president... 5 kids from 3 different wives... caught talking about grabbing women by the p*ssy... obsessed with self-image... constantly engaging in self-serving behavior and rhetoric and lauding himself with praise for accomplishments while never admitting mistakes... didn't earn or work for his fortune but inherited it... a dozen or more accusations of some degree of sexual assault, along with dozens of pictures of you touching your daughter in creepy-ass ways, and giving interviews talking about how sexually appealing you think she is... bows to North Korean generals (after threatening them on Twitter with Nuclear war)... think about it. I'm just getting started here... just keep going down the line.

The alternative history novel writes itself... Except it doesn't, cuz this guy doesn't realistically make it into the primaries, much less win them, much less win the presidency. Any attempt to write a book like would wreak of ridiculousness. Not because dems can't be ridiculous... it's just that this would never happen. I didn't think conservatives would drop to that level either, but alas here we are.

It's not about policy though. I'll still insist that Trump wasn't some sort of boss-level "hard-right uber-conservative." He was a selfish, nativist, boarish, pathetic, rapey Trust Fund Baby who did some nice things for wealthy people and business owners and enthusiastically talked-up poor whites in relation to their peers. Sure there's some right-wingishness in cutting taxes and regulations and being a nativist, and will put conservatives on the Supreme Court, but what else is new. That's anyone with an R behind their name. Which is why I don't entirely mind people being like "Trump is a POS but he's gonna lower my taxes and give me a conservative court." That's not cultish. That's an accurate assessment of reality, even if I disagree with the implicit value-set implied by that attitude. It's the blind defense of the figure-head of some perceived "movement" while he proceeds to lead them down the path of ridiculousness that makes them fucking crazy.

But it has to be pointed out that this is a subset of the craziness of the statism cult. Republicans have done this before, and Democrats do this too. Just not in a way that so-highlights how bat-shit-nuts they're willing to appear.
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:11 am

Mark Leavy wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:53 am
doodle wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:03 am

Lawyers for pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell said that “no reasonable person” would believe that her false conspiracies about the 2020 election were “truly statements of fact.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/pro-tr ... act.html
Brilliant! If I am ever charged with anything, I am totally going with the Chewbacca Defense. That's why Sydney makes the big bucks. I expect her to prevail.
Prevail? lol...

I don't think merely not losing a $1.3 Billion defamation suit against her was the kind of legal victory Sydney had in mind back in November.
User avatar
GT
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:54 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by GT » Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:45 am

doodle wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:03 am

Lawyers for pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell said that “no reasonable person” would believe that her false conspiracies about the 2020 election were “truly statements of fact.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/pro-tr ... act.html
I think she could have done better after getting caught....

Why not just pull a "Brennan" and claim you received "bad info" - only takes one sentence to admit the mistake and another to be glad it all worked out. Does not matter that he spread this fake news for months.

“I don't know if I received bad information, but I think I suspected there was more than there actually was,” Brennan told MSNBC’s “Morning Joe.”
“I am relieved that it’s been determined there was not a criminal conspiracy with the Russian government over our election.”

Or pull a "Washington post" and just claim an error was made. Does not matter that the paper spread this fake news - just make a correction.

Washington Post adds lengthy correction to report on Trump call with Georgia elections investigator

"Trump did not tell the investigator to 'find the fraud' or say she would be 'a national hero' if she did so. Instead, Trump urged the investigator to scrutinize ballots in Fulton County, Ga., asserting she would find 'dishonesty' there. He also told her that she had 'the most important job in the country right now.'"

It really is disgusting when you think of how many lies are told to the American people everyday.....
User avatar
doodle
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4603
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:17 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by doodle » Wed Mar 24, 2021 12:12 pm

moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:11 am
Mark Leavy wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:53 am
doodle wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:03 am

Lawyers for pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell said that “no reasonable person” would believe that her false conspiracies about the 2020 election were “truly statements of fact.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/pro-tr ... act.html
Brilliant! If I am ever charged with anything, I am totally going with the Chewbacca Defense. That's why Sydney makes the big bucks. I expect her to prevail.
Prevail? lol...

I don't think merely not losing a $1.3 Billion defamation suit against her was the kind of legal victory Sydney had in mind back in November.

To prove prima facie defamation, a plaintiff must show four things: 1) a false statement purporting to be fact; 2) publication or communication of that statement to a third person; 3) fault amounting to at least negligence; and 4) damages, or some harm caused to the person or entity who is the subject of the statement.
I'm not sure what legal angle she's after here...seems like her defense shoehorns her even further into guilt.
User avatar
pugchief
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4492
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:41 pm
Location: suburbs of Chicago, IL

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by pugchief » Wed Mar 24, 2021 12:21 pm

moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 10:29 am
"Trump is a POS but he's gonna lower my taxes and give me a conservative court." That's not cultish. That's an accurate assessment of reality, even if I disagree with the implicit value-set implied by that attitude. It's the blind defense of the figure-head of some perceived "movement" while he proceeds to lead them down the path of ridiculousness that makes them fucking crazy.
Gee, just like the idiots that voted for a senile octogenarian who can barely walk, just bc he wasn't Trump, but knowing that the policies that would come from behind the Curtain of Oz running him would be ruinous to the country.
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:12 pm

pugchief wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 12:21 pm
moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 10:29 am
"Trump is a POS but he's gonna lower my taxes and give me a conservative court." That's not cultish. That's an accurate assessment of reality, even if I disagree with the implicit value-set implied by that attitude. It's the blind defense of the figure-head of some perceived "movement" while he proceeds to lead them down the path of ridiculousness that makes them fucking crazy.
Gee, just like the idiots that voted for a senile octogenarian who can barely walk, just bc he wasn't Trump, but knowing that the policies that would come from behind the Curtain of Oz running him would be ruinous to the country.
Voting for an old senile centrist democrat as a punt to avoid another 4 years of Trump isn't crazy cultism. it's pretty typical electoral pragmatism. If anything, I think most of the people who voted for him simply saw him as about as status quo as a president could be. They made the same pragmatic decision as some of the unenthusiastic Trump voters did in 2016 when they hated Hillary and wanted tax cuts so they figured they'd put up with the derp for 4 years, but just with different priorities.

And I don't think the vast majority of Biden voters think that his policies would be "ruinous to the country." Now maybe Biden voters are crazy to think that his policies won't be disastrous. You're free to defend that point with evidence. But that's very different from dems intentionally voting for disastrous policies just because they don't like the guy he'd replace.

Lastly, there may be crazy Biden sycophants. The closest to these I've seen are democrat boomers who have an affinity for Biden, but even then it's nowhere near the level of the cultish nature of Trump's support. They're actually quite centrist in nature, compared to their Gen Y/Z counterparts, who are mostly willing to admit Biden is a creepy, senile war-monger. It's pretty typical partisan loyalty bullshit that we saw with Bush v Gore, Obama v McCain, etc. Is it pathetic? Yes. But it's the same shit we saw on "the right" before Trump or see from them now with non-Trump politicians... boring, pathetic, run of the mill, "defend your team" bullshit. The Trump Cult is/was something much more stark.
User avatar
GT
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:54 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by GT » Wed Mar 24, 2021 2:17 pm

moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:12 pm
pugchief wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 12:21 pm
moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 10:29 am
"Trump is a POS but he's gonna lower my taxes and give me a conservative court." That's not cultish. That's an accurate assessment of reality, even if I disagree with the implicit value-set implied by that attitude. It's the blind defense of the figure-head of some perceived "movement" while he proceeds to lead them down the path of ridiculousness that makes them fucking crazy.
Gee, just like the idiots that voted for a senile octogenarian who can barely walk, just bc he wasn't Trump, but knowing that the policies that would come from behind the Curtain of Oz running him would be ruinous to the country.
Voting for an old senile centrist democrat as a punt to avoid another 4 years of Trump isn't crazy cultism. it's pretty typical electoral pragmatism. If anything, I think most of the people who voted for him simply saw him as about as status quo as a president could be. They made the same pragmatic decision as some of the unenthusiastic Trump voters did in 2016 when they hated Hillary and wanted tax cuts so they figured they'd put up with the derp for 4 years, but just with different priorities.

And I don't think the vast majority of Biden voters think that his policies would be "ruinous to the country." Now maybe Biden voters are crazy to think that his policies won't be disastrous. You're free to defend that point with evidence. But that's very different from dems intentionally voting for disastrous policies just because they don't like the guy he'd replace.

Lastly, there may be crazy Biden sycophants. The closest to these I've seen are democrat boomers who have an affinity for Biden, but even then it's nowhere near the level of the cultish nature of Trump's support. They're actually quite centrist in nature, compared to their Gen Y/Z counterparts, who are mostly willing to admit Biden is a creepy, senile war-monger. It's pretty typical partisan loyalty bullshit that we saw with Bush v Gore, Obama v McCain, etc. Is it pathetic? Yes. But it's the same shit we saw on "the right" before Trump or see from them now with non-Trump politicians... boring, pathetic, run of the mill, "defend your team" bullshit. The Trump Cult is/was something much more stark.
Cultish nature of Trump's support
Do you think Obama developed a cultish following? real question - I think so...

And I don't think the vast majority of Biden voters think that his policies would be "ruinous to the country."
What metrics would Biden votes us to determine this... jobs report - stock market - number of riots - world trade - real question
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:20 pm

GT wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 2:17 pm
moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:12 pm
pugchief wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 12:21 pm
moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 10:29 am
"Trump is a POS but he's gonna lower my taxes and give me a conservative court." That's not cultish. That's an accurate assessment of reality, even if I disagree with the implicit value-set implied by that attitude. It's the blind defense of the figure-head of some perceived "movement" while he proceeds to lead them down the path of ridiculousness that makes them fucking crazy.
Gee, just like the idiots that voted for a senile octogenarian who can barely walk, just bc he wasn't Trump, but knowing that the policies that would come from behind the Curtain of Oz running him would be ruinous to the country.
Voting for an old senile centrist democrat as a punt to avoid another 4 years of Trump isn't crazy cultism. it's pretty typical electoral pragmatism. If anything, I think most of the people who voted for him simply saw him as about as status quo as a president could be. They made the same pragmatic decision as some of the unenthusiastic Trump voters did in 2016 when they hated Hillary and wanted tax cuts so they figured they'd put up with the derp for 4 years, but just with different priorities.

And I don't think the vast majority of Biden voters think that his policies would be "ruinous to the country." Now maybe Biden voters are crazy to think that his policies won't be disastrous. You're free to defend that point with evidence. But that's very different from dems intentionally voting for disastrous policies just because they don't like the guy he'd replace.

Lastly, there may be crazy Biden sycophants. The closest to these I've seen are democrat boomers who have an affinity for Biden, but even then it's nowhere near the level of the cultish nature of Trump's support. They're actually quite centrist in nature, compared to their Gen Y/Z counterparts, who are mostly willing to admit Biden is a creepy, senile war-monger. It's pretty typical partisan loyalty bullshit that we saw with Bush v Gore, Obama v McCain, etc. Is it pathetic? Yes. But it's the same shit we saw on "the right" before Trump or see from them now with non-Trump politicians... boring, pathetic, run of the mill, "defend your team" bullshit. The Trump Cult is/was something much more stark.
Cultish nature of Trump's support
Do you think Obama developed a cultish following? real question - I think so...

And I don't think the vast majority of Biden voters think that his policies would be "ruinous to the country."
What metrics would Biden votes us to determine this... jobs report - stock market - number of riots - world trade - real question
I believe I probably contradicted myself a bit. I probably shouldn’t have said that a pragmatic vote for Biden doesn’t represent cultism. I believe it many who voted for Biden to not only belong to the cult of statism but also one of its sub-cults, which is the partisan team cult of Democrats.

That-said, I find the cult of Trumpism to contain everything bad about general statism and partisanship but with an extra layer of brain-deadedness.

Yes Obama sycophants were cultish in their love for him, but I put this in a category similar to Reaganism. Basically, it’s just easier to understand people being drawn to someone who is that charismatic. Obama and Reagan both had the ability to deliver a 1 hour speech where they say next to nothing but the words sound poetic and meaningful so people fall all over themselves for it if they’re inclined in that direction anyway.

The difference with Trump is his anti-charisma. He doesn’t have one redeeming human trait. He lies constantly. His behavior is boorish. He contradicts himself within a sentence. So the amount of mental gymnastics Trumpists have to go through to defend their enthusiastic support of him is mind-numbing.

Sure, some will be honest and admit, “I did it for muh tax cuts and muh judges,” but there’s a level of support there that’s beyond pragmatism.

To your other question, I believe most voters with partisan motives use moving targets on the economy to measure success. This would include partisan democrats who voted for Biden. That-said, they don’t necessarily think Biden will produce disastrous results in the areas you mentioned and others and intend on making an excuse for it. They, like most people, will just be reluctant to consider any measures that do get worse under Biden as valid measuring sticks for (insert reason here).

Non-partisan Biden voters are probably a mish-mash of folks, most of whom probably think unemployment and gas prices and the stock market are (perhaps) the best economic indicators.

Overall people give way too much blame/credit to presidents for the economy. It’s part of the cult thing. Hell I used to have very positive opinions of Bill Clinton for that very reason before I woke the F up.

For a bit of perspective on where I’m coming from, I voted for Biden mostly because I thought there was a slightly higher chance that we avoid a disastrous foreign policy blunder with him than with Trump. I was almost convinced otherwise on this, but came down for Biden. Little of my vote had to do with what I thought he’d do marginally for me on the economy, however. So I find it difficult to get in the heads of the average Biden voter on what they expect from him on that front. To me, stagnant real wages is the most important underlying issue in economics. Trump made gestures towards this mindset but most were empty.

Had I voted for Trump it would likely have been because he proved somewhat better on some foreign policy issues than Biden to edge him out there. But I’ll tell ya, I still would’ve had zero illusions about the cult I was temporarily allying with. They largely don’t care about ending wars, but instead either achieving their nativist fantasy or having fun fighting the culture war along the way.
User avatar
pugchief
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4492
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:41 pm
Location: suburbs of Chicago, IL

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by pugchief » Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:28 pm

moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:20 pm

For a bit of perspective on where I’m coming from, I voted for Biden mostly because I thought there was a slightly higher chance that we avoid a disastrous foreign policy blunder with him than with Trump.
How's that workin' out for you? Trump had radical Muslims, N Korea, Iran and China under control and now they are all running wild again. Thanks, Joe Kamala.
User avatar
Xan
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 3400
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:51 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by Xan » Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:39 pm

moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:20 pm
To me, stagnant real wages is the most important underlying issue in economics. Trump made gestures towards this mindset but most were empty.
Moda, am I remembering incorrectly, or have you in the past argued that we need to stop being focused on growth, and work more towards sustainability? Why would you expect/want real wages to be growing? (Apologies if I'm wrong.)
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:50 pm

pugchief wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:28 pm
moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:20 pm

For a bit of perspective on where I’m coming from, I voted for Biden mostly because I thought there was a slightly higher chance that we avoid a disastrous foreign policy blunder with him than with Trump.
How's that workin' out for you? Trump had radical Muslims, N Korea, Iran and China under control and now they are all running wild again. Thanks, Joe Kamala.
I don’t consider anything that Biden (or Kamala) has done to be in the real of “disastrous” yet, but on a more general basis I’d probably disagree with almost everything in your loaded assertions.

But I’m open to changing my mind. I’d like to get a more fleshed out analysis than what you just posted. Who do you follow on foreign policy stuff that you think does the best job of clarifying these topics for you?

Most of the people I follow are anti-war types at this point. Some of them right-wing in their other politics, so it’s by no means a Biden/librul thing. I’d like to hear other perspectives on a more regular basis.
User avatar
GT
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:54 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by GT » Wed Mar 24, 2021 5:14 pm

To your other question, I believe most voters with partisan motives use moving targets on the economy to measure success. This would include partisan democrats who voted for Biden. That-said, they don’t necessarily think Biden will produce disastrous results in the areas you mentioned and others and intend on making an excuse for it. They, like most people, will just be reluctant to consider any measures that do get worse under Biden as valid measuring sticks for (insert reason here).


I think you are on to something - If a person voted for Biden then they have a vested interest in seeming him do well or a natural bias for covering with a " its not that bad or its not his fault".

I don't think Biden will make 4 years. He is struggling in the first couple of months (no press conference in the first 50 days - hiding from the kids in cages at the border - China and Russia have already challenged him. The press will not hold him accountable which will make his struggles worse as nothing will get resolved. It would be nice to be wrong - my 401K could use a few more good years....
User avatar
moda0306
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 7665
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:05 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by moda0306 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 5:55 pm

Xan wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:39 pm
moda0306 wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:20 pm
To me, stagnant real wages is the most important underlying issue in economics. Trump made gestures towards this mindset but most were empty.
Moda, am I remembering incorrectly, or have you in the past argued that we need to stop being focused on growth, and work more towards sustainability? Why would you expect/want real wages to be growing? (Apologies if I'm wrong.)
Xan,

I tend to think that building an economy that not just does but structurally needs to grow exponentially to avoid collapsing is a bad idea. That-said, it's what we currently have, and whether we have growth or do not, we can always increase wages by reducing the return on capital and shifting it to wages.

And I'm not THAT opposed to the idea of growth. It's just dumbfounding to me that we don't question this need to grow real GDP exponentially every year while wages go nowhere, and our financial security becomes more and more precarious.
User avatar
sophie
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4431
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:15 pm

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by sophie » Wed Mar 24, 2021 5:58 pm

Actually I think most people who voted for Biden could not tell you what his policies are if you asked them.

They voted for him because they were told so by numerous mainstream media outlets.

If you ask these people for reasons, you would hear the following: 1) they hated trump. 2) sunshine and ponies would fill the skies if Biden got elected. 3) Racial disparities would disappear to the benefit of all. 4) we would welcome "new immigrants" with open arms and to wonderful effect. 5) COVID would disappear because Biden would handle it better than Trump.

I don't think it ever got any more detailed than that.
flyingpylon
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 788
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 9:04 am

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by flyingpylon » Wed Mar 24, 2021 6:11 pm

sophie wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 5:58 pm
Actually I think most people who voted for Biden could not tell you what his policies are if you asked them.

They voted for him because they were told so by numerous mainstream media outlets.

If you ask these people for reasons, you would hear the following: 1) they hated trump. 2) sunshine and ponies would fill the skies if Biden got elected. 3) Racial disparities would disappear to the benefit of all. 4) we would welcome "new immigrants" with open arms and to wonderful effect. 5) COVID would disappear because Biden would handle it better than Trump.

I don't think it ever got any more detailed than that.
No, in fact it was more vague than that: “unity and healing”.
SomeDude
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 824
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:45 am

Re: Sydney Powell's defense

Post by SomeDude » Wed Mar 24, 2021 6:17 pm

flyingpylon wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 6:11 pm
sophie wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 5:58 pm
Actually I think most people who voted for Biden could not tell you what his policies are if you asked them.

They voted for him because they were told so by numerous mainstream media outlets.

If you ask these people for reasons, you would hear the following: 1) they hated trump. 2) sunshine and ponies would fill the skies if Biden got elected. 3) Racial disparities would disappear to the benefit of all. 4) we would welcome "new immigrants" with open arms and to wonderful effect. 5) COVID would disappear because Biden would handle it better than Trump.

I don't think it ever got any more detailed than that.
No, in fact it was more vague than that: “unity and healing”.
Let's be honest here.....a lot of the Biden votes were fake and sitting in suitcases under the tables. That's why they had to kick out the poll watchers for days while they counted them and board up the windows. Its also why YouTube and twitter/fb kicked off anyone disputing the fraud.

The truth doesn't require protection, lies do.

Obviously the reality that a criminal gang has complete control of the government is too much for some otherwise smart people to handle so they tell themselves and each other that up is down and black is white.
Post Reply