70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post Reply
User avatar
tomfoolery
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 910
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:47 pm

70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by tomfoolery » Mon May 03, 2021 12:13 pm

Of course we can’t get people to wear masks and get vaccines when 70% of republicans are Trumpanzees who believe the falsehood that the election was rigged.

And now we have a dog and pony show of some so-called ninjas doing a pseudo-audit in Arizona that is closed to the press except the Trumponians at ONe Fake News Network.

Seriously how do republicans believe this stuff?

This election stealing nonsense is the big lie of our generation. And it’s being justified to enact voter suppression laws that put Jim Crow to shame. Also something about climate crisis.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/30/politics ... index.html
πŸ’‰
User avatar
I Shrugged
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 1351
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:35 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by I Shrugged » Mon May 03, 2021 2:08 pm

Why do 30% of your fellow Democrats also believe that Trump won the election?
User avatar
sophie
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4426
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:15 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by sophie » Mon May 03, 2021 2:40 pm

The undertone here is: How dare the American people disagree with us, CNN, the font of all that is holy?? Based on their numbers it looks like about half the population (70% of Republicans, 30% of Democrats) believe that the election results were not valid. I don't care what CNN's opinion is, in the face of numbers like that. This rises to the level of a constitutional crisis.

And by the way, CNN's position is not supported in the slightest. There were a number of concrete allegations made, ranging from pointing out statistical anomalies that could not be explained to reports of non-legitimately sourced ballots to irregularities in how ballot inspections and voting observers were treated. None of them, to my knowledge, have ever been specifically investigated, still less refuted. So I don't know how they can say that the allegations are either true or false. I certainly can't say that either, which means that I still believe it is possible that the election's outcome was altered by unfair means. Which means that the election needs to be considered illegitimate until that possibility can be ruled out.

Note that I'm not saying that this is more than a possibility. It's also perfectly understandable to me that plenty of people could have voted in favor of Republican candidates but voted against Trump because they couldn't stand him. Actually I should say that I expect that probably was the case..."understandable" is too strong because, well, be careful what you wish for...a lot of those people are almost certainly regretting their choice, or will soon once they realize what's happening.
glennds
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 716
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:24 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by glennds » Mon May 03, 2021 3:35 pm

I Shrugged wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 2:08 pm
Why do 30% of your fellow Democrats also believe that Trump won the election?
That's not what the article he linked says.
... Although there is no evidence of fraud or wrongdoing in the 2020 election, many still say that Biden did not legitimately win enough votes to become president. The poll suggests the share of Americans who believe that falsehood has held roughly steady since just before he took office in January at 30%. Those doubts are concentrated among Republicans, 70% of whom say they do not think Biden won enough votes to be president.....
For whatever it's worth, and not saying I agree or disagree with it.
Don
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 181
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:21 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by Don » Mon May 03, 2021 4:36 pm

tomfoolery wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 12:13 pm
Of course we can’t get people to wear masks and get vaccines when 70% of republicans are Trumpanzees who believe the falsehood that the election was rigged.

And now we have a dog and pony show of some so-called ninjas doing a pseudo-audit in Arizona that is closed to the press except the Trumponians at ONe Fake News Network.

Seriously how do republicans believe this stuff?

This election stealing nonsense is the big lie of our generation. And it’s being justified to enact voter suppression laws that put Jim Crow to shame. Also something about climate crisis.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/30/politics ... index.html

You sound worried. Deep down you know that the election was stolen but you don't care because to liberals and communists the end always justifies the means.
User avatar
I Shrugged
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 1351
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:35 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by I Shrugged » Mon May 03, 2021 5:15 pm

glennds wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 3:35 pm
I Shrugged wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 2:08 pm
Why do 30% of your fellow Democrats also believe that Trump won the election?
That's not what the article he linked says.
... Although there is no evidence of fraud or wrongdoing in the 2020 election, many still say that Biden did not legitimately win enough votes to become president. The poll suggests the share of Americans who believe that falsehood has held roughly steady since just before he took office in January at 30%. Those doubts are concentrated among Republicans, 70% of whom say they do not think Biden won enough votes to be president.....
For whatever it's worth, and not saying I agree or disagree with it.
I didn't read the linked article. I was just repeating something I heard on the internet. So it must be true.
User avatar
tomfoolery
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 910
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:47 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by tomfoolery » Mon May 03, 2021 5:41 pm

Don wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 4:36 pm

You sound worried. Deep down you know that the election was stolen but you don't care because to liberals and communists the end always justifies the means.
I'm not worried. Do I sound worried? I'm not worried. The truth is on my side. Republicans have been fear mongering for years to unite their base on a foundation of fear and lies.

Democrats' foundation is science and truth.

Science and truth beats fear and lies every time, my misguided friend.
πŸ’‰
glennds
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 716
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:24 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by glennds » Mon May 03, 2021 5:52 pm

Don wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 4:36 pm
tomfoolery wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 12:13 pm
Of course we can’t get people to wear masks and get vaccines when 70% of republicans are Trumpanzees who believe the falsehood that the election was rigged.

And now we have a dog and pony show of some so-called ninjas doing a pseudo-audit in Arizona that is closed to the press except the Trumponians at ONe Fake News Network.

Seriously how do republicans believe this stuff?

This election stealing nonsense is the big lie of our generation. And it’s being justified to enact voter suppression laws that put Jim Crow to shame. Also something about climate crisis.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/30/politics ... index.html

You sound worried. Deep down you know that the election was stolen but you don't care because to liberals and communists the end always justifies the means.

How come he only sounds worried, but when I said it, I sounded worried AND guilty?
Don
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 181
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:21 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by Don » Mon May 03, 2021 6:45 pm

Haha! You got me there.
fenns
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:35 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by fenns » Tue May 04, 2021 1:42 am

there is no doubt bad things happened

https://www.wral.com/pennsylvania-man-s ... ersion=amp
SomeDude
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 800
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:45 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by SomeDude » Tue May 04, 2021 4:38 pm

I Shrugged wrote: ↑
Mon May 03, 2021 2:08 pm
Why do 30% of your fellow Democrats also believe that Trump won the election?
Because 70% of democrats are obviously liars as opposed to 30% of repukes.

They literally kicked out poll watchers and boarded up windows while batches of unfolded ballots with only Joe's name on them continued to be counted. Trump was up by a landslide on election night. He only got 1% of the votes cast and counted after.

Biden and Harris were so unpopular Trump probably got over 400 electoral votes.
User avatar
MarketIfTouched
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2018 4:46 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by MarketIfTouched » Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm

So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
User avatar
vnatale
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 5940
Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:56 pm
Location: Massachusetts
Contact:

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by vnatale » Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm

MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm

So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.



We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
glennds
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 716
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:24 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by glennds » Thu May 13, 2021 11:16 pm

vnatale wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm
MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm
So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?
The same kind of geniuses that are capable of concocting a pandemic, and then masterminding a vaccine that is really an instrument of genocide, all for reasons that would be impossible for a normal mortal to grasp.
flyingpylon
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 782
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 9:04 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by flyingpylon » Fri May 14, 2021 4:38 am

vnatale wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm
MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm
So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?
Not taking a side on this topic, but all it takes is a handful of counties in a handful of states to swing an election.
User avatar
vnatale
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 5940
Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:56 pm
Location: Massachusetts
Contact:

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by vnatale » Fri May 14, 2021 8:28 am

flyingpylon wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 4:38 am

vnatale wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm

MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm

So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.



We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?


Not taking a side on this topic, but all it takes is a handful of counties in a handful of states to swing an election.


Yes. But who is the mastermind behind this highly selective process AND with the knowledge to be able to interfere with each of these unique systems?
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
User avatar
Xan
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 3394
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:51 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by Xan » Fri May 14, 2021 9:06 am

vnatale wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 8:28 am
flyingpylon wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 4:38 am
vnatale wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm
MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm
So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?
Not taking a side on this topic, but all it takes is a handful of counties in a handful of states to swing an election.
Yes. But who is the mastermind behind this highly selective process AND with the knowledge to be able to interfere with each of these unique systems?
Especially in light of the pipeline topic being raised, I think this is a weird question. With the stakes being much, much higher than a $5 million ransom, you don't think somebody could hack a significant number of the swing counties in the country, many of which are responsible for their own IT security?
User avatar
vnatale
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 5940
Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:56 pm
Location: Massachusetts
Contact:

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by vnatale » Fri May 14, 2021 10:33 am

Xan wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 9:06 am

vnatale wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 8:28 am

flyingpylon wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 4:38 am

vnatale wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm

MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm

So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.



We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?


Not taking a side on this topic, but all it takes is a handful of counties in a handful of states to swing an election.


Yes. But who is the mastermind behind this highly selective process AND with the knowledge to be able to interfere with each of these unique systems?


Especially in light of the pipeline topic being raised, I think this is a weird question. With the stakes being much, much higher than a $5 million ransom, you don't think somebody could hack a significant number of the swing counties in the country, many of which are responsible for their own IT security?


I think many in this forum, including you, are better qualified to answer that question than me. The pipeline was one challenge to overcome. Here there are a handful X a handful of challenges to overcome.
Above provided by: Vinny, who always says: "I only regret that I have but one lap to give to my cats."
User avatar
Xan
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 3394
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:51 pm

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by Xan » Fri May 14, 2021 10:44 am

vnatale wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 10:33 am
Xan wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 9:06 am
vnatale wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 8:28 am
flyingpylon wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 4:38 am
vnatale wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 10:28 pm
MarketIfTouched wrote: ↑
Thu May 13, 2021 9:36 pm
So a nefarious entity can disrupt computer systems operations at a major private oil pipeline, and a disruption to public voting computer systems is inconceivable?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
We have 50 different states each with 50 unique voting processes. What entity is going to master / disrupt that?
Not taking a side on this topic, but all it takes is a handful of counties in a handful of states to swing an election.
Yes. But who is the mastermind behind this highly selective process AND with the knowledge to be able to interfere with each of these unique systems?
Especially in light of the pipeline topic being raised, I think this is a weird question. With the stakes being much, much higher than a $5 million ransom, you don't think somebody could hack a significant number of the swing counties in the country, many of which are responsible for their own IT security?
I think many in this forum, including you, are better qualified to answer that question than me. The pipeline was one challenge to overcome. Here there are a handful X a handful of challenges to overcome.
I would say that "take down this particular pipeline" is probably much harder than "find 15 out of these 100 counties that you can hack".

To be fair, the hackers who hacked the pipeline didn't have to hack that particular pipeline; they're just looking for companies in general that they can hack and found that one.

Edit: I would also say that given significant incentive, like swinging a presidential election, ANY system that is accessible from the public Internet is probably hackable pretty easily. Not saying whether or not that happened at any given time. But really no system can be said to be unhackable if it's on the Internet. So one big question is, how air-gapped are all these counties' voting systems? And even when they're air-gapped, what are the protocols surrounding access to the machines? For example, the US and Israel (it seems) cooperated to create a worm called StuxNet that infected air-gapped Iranian nuclear centrifuges. Do we think Russia and China aren't trying something similar?
User avatar
Tortoise
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 2545
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2010 2:35 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by Tortoise » Fri May 14, 2021 2:11 pm

You guys are considering an "Ocean's Eleven" type of scenario of sophisticated hackers possibly swinging the election.

But when you have universal mail-in voting with no voter ID requirement, the ability to kick poll watchers out of polling places without any consequences, and the ability to stretch out vote-counting over days or weeks, even the Three Stooges probably could have swung the election.

I would never question the integrity of our election, of course. As tomfoolery pointed out, that would be Trumpanzee extremism. Just making an observation that the hacker theory is probably overkill.
glennds
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 716
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:24 am

Re: 70% of Republicans Believe Falsehood of Stolen Election

Post by glennds » Fri May 14, 2021 2:33 pm

Tortoise wrote: ↑
Fri May 14, 2021 2:11 pm

But when you have universal mail-in voting with no voter ID requirement, the ability to kick poll watchers out of polling places without any consequences, and the ability to stretch out vote-counting over days or weeks, even the Three Stooges probably could have swung the election.
I could see Moe, Curly and even Shemp going in on something like that.
But never Larry.
Post Reply